Ask Lemmy

Finally a good use for the decoration I hung up my place some years ago!

This is just my opinion and personal experience, but people that really want a child don't really debate with themselves over whether they should have a child or a pet. Yea, it's a big, expensive, and rideable pet, but that seems to be what it boils down to. Based on that, I'm feeling that you don't want a kid.

If you have to ask for advice for having a child don’t. Don’t bring a child into this world unless you are 100% all in regardless of what others (besides your partner of course) say.

The child has no say in being born, so the parents should be 100% ready for it. Anything less isn’t fair to him or her.

Never buy anything that flies, fucks or floats. No planes, no boats, no horses. If you really want to try one of these, try renting or borrowing the thing for a whole summer. Maybe even two summers.

I think horses are FAR more expensive than you think they are.

Huh. Strange opinions I read in the comments.

On moral decision: I will argue bringing a kind to this messed up world is a morally good thing. There have always been good and bad times. And we need people to make those good times. Well raised and well trained people. Even if our generation screwed up, we can at least equip the next generation with knowledge and love to fix what we could not. What about if the world and existence were beautiful and fun to experience? In that case no one would object you to bring a kid to this world. I will tell you a secret. World IS beautiful and fun. It is all about perspective. Well this fully depends on you seeing a glass half full and teaching your kids to see it the same way... Lots of people in the comments seeing this glass not just half empty but seeing it completely empty.

You can also live your life serving others or just serving yourself. It is always more beneficial for you to serve yourself. However serving other can be more rewarding. Serving others is always sacrificial. In case of raising a kid there are some really major sacrifices to be made including all you already mentioned. But this is also one of the best thing you can do for another person. For example even by volunteering you usually do not give people life, do everything for them until you prepare them for living their life on their own. You will have to sacrifice almost everything.

While having a kid will also have some benefits (eg. increased chance of not dying alone). You should not do this for yourself. Raising kids is about them not you.

I personally think if there are kids for adoption it would be morally better to adopt. Because you not only give a happy life to a kid. But you also save someone from a lot of struggle at the same time. However it would be still better to bring another happy and well raised kid to the world if you decide not to adopt (eg. If you feel you could not love someone else's kid as much as your own)

On actual decision:

• Do what you think is right. Not what will benefit you the most. The empty side of the glass is empty because people decided to prioritize their own benefits over what is right. (You might figure out having a kid not the right thing for you)
• You should know no parent is ever ready to have kids. Parents are just kids having kids. What makes parents parents is a will to sacrifice and will to learn.
• If you decide to have a kid, you should first get your finances in order.
• if you decide to have a kid, you should marry first. To secure your kids future as much as possible.
• Remember having a kid is about them not you.

Does your partner want a horse, or is it just you?

If you are questioning whether or not to become a parent, then you should not become a parent. This is something that you should be 100% on-board with, not something you are unsure.

Fwiw, I'm childfree and have absolutely zero regrets. If anything, life and world events since I fully committed to my decision (i.e. surgery) have reinforced my choice.

Another option is to adopt a kid who's like >12 who you can set up a good future for without having to spend as much money or 18 years.

A lot of the kids in foster care go homeless when they turn 18, and you could prevent that for someone :)

Adopt the kid, gets around the moral issue of bringing a child into the world. The kid is already in the world, you just provide for them.

Please don't have a child if you are really considering this.

Given how expensive it is to raise a mix, it's more like "have a kid or buy a house".

I got a bunch of kids. Don't have kids. The government wants to them for the next war.

Don't have a horse. Horses stink. Just ride a horse a few times and if you still want to ride the horse again. Then go home. There's no net positive coming from having a horse.

I feel like you shouldn't be solely relying on other people's opinions for important life decisions.

Because the thing is: You ask the internet and 99% will tell you "don't have a child", you ask friends and relatives IRL and they 90% will say "yes have a child", but like... you won't end up living your own life, you are just walking down a path someone else chose for you

Don't have children for their sake. It's not about you. The world is entering a transition phase, and while no one can predict the future, odds are its going to be incredibly unfriendly to everyone and everything.

Reject tradition. Embrace horse.

Seriously, it sounds like you don't have the financial slack to raise a child without making yourself miserable. You know what makes kids miserable? Having miserable parents. Sure, if you saw kids as your one and only purpose in life that you would do anything for, then you could totally have kids. But lacking that commitment, and significant financial means, and a robust social support system, the most likely outcome is that you will spend the next decade and a half absolutely haggard and thinking about how you should have just got a horse.

Otoh, my actual recommendation is to have neither a child nor a horse, and instead use the extra money to give yourself a more robust financial safety net. Iirc, you can volunteer time at stables to get horse time for free.

Also consider the child's life and future. Will they have a realistic chance of leading a good adult life? With how the world is going it's something I feel quite uncertain about, which is one reason why I personally won't have kids.

Unless you have unlimited wealth I wouldn't go with a horse unless you can board it yourself. Otherwise you're just leasing and will miss out on most of the bonding that makes up a large part of the horse relationship. It's all the cost and then some for a third of the reward.

The pros/cons seem stacked because they are. This is coming from my perspective of someone who has chosen not to have children, but has friends who have.

It's not something you can really pro/con to make the "right" choice. You have to want to do it in spite of it changing your relationship, your body, your lifestyle, your everything. In some ways better, some worse. Some changes will evolve or ebb and flow with the seasons of life, and some will just be permanent.

I know that I can't handle all that uncertainty, all that change. And while I also never really had the desire to raise and shape a child, as I've gotten older I've realized that I get to have those moments. In doses I can handle and without sacrifices, because they are not my kids. I'm an auntie (biological and chosen). I have plenty of friends with kids (and plenty without). I feel like I get the best of both worlds.

Imagine your life in both scenarios. What brings you the most joy?

Well you can sell the horse, you can't sell the child... And you probably will sell the horse.

How far do you live next to the place you would board it?

I lived next to a place that sells, trains and boards horses and their bread and butter is people who don't have land and have never owned a horse. The turnover rate is incredibly high, they had one horse that changed hands 5 times haha and it was a perfect horse in my opinion.

Just pay for riding lessons, you could get like an infinite amount of them for the full cost of modern horse ownership.

I'd add the stuff only people with kids understand to the "pros" list. The standard model human is biologically wired to find the experience rewarding, while you may or may not like horses as much as you think you would.

Is freezing eggs and getting the horse first an option? You can, indeed, sell it and try again later.

The actual choice is subjective, so I'll echo that you shouldn't let Lemmy decide for you. A lot of people are projecting their own preferences here. Or your partner for that matter.

No kids and a horse atm. Take your money and invest it in yourselves. Horses and kids are expensive as fuck

I hear they're both pretty expensive.

Consider that if you have children, they will grow up in a world where the rabidly anti-child people of Lemmy will be getting older and dying off. There's a brighter future ahead.

The horse won't live to see that era.

If you're in the US, I'd consider selling everything and emigrating instead. Nevermind the children, do you have a future?

We have twins, they're nearly 2.

IDK about the career angle. Would taking a year or 2 off in your thirties meaningfully effect your trajectory? You and your partner could alternate, you take a few years off, then he does. Or you could both go part time. Are there other ways you can stay connected to your industry? Additional study?

Statistically caring for a child may not be a good career move, but I suspect a large part of that is that having a child changes your priorities. Your career might take second place, not because it has to, but because you're far more interested in hanging out with your kid.

Paying someone for help is a nice idea but it didn't really work for us. We had 2x au pairs for a while, paid minders to help out on weekends et cetera. Here day care is heavily subsidised. They started that when they were about 15 months, 3 days a week. That has been a game changer obviously.

We've never done date night per se. We do family outings several times a week. We both make sure the other gets a few hours off every few days. I'm not saying this is "the right way", some cracks in our relationship have definitely appeared and developed over the last several years. We just wake up every day and do whatever needs to be done.

I'm just not interested in Horses so I just can't comment on that. I'm really into bikes though. I bought an epic e-bike powerful enough to haul my kids around in this trailer thing. They love it. I love it. It was financially reckless, cost about 9 weeks average wage, but I don't regret the purchase. I will say though, you should talk to someone who has a horse and pays for all the things. For me the novelty would def wear off super quick.

The thing that I find striking about your post is the analysis. We didn't analyse the decision to have kids. It was just something we wanted to do. We didn't have answers for all the questions, or even bother to ask those questions, because literally every one of my ancestors has just gotten pregnant and figured the rest out day by day.