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I think the number one thing that made it possible was the willingness to try. Covid hit; very early in the cruise ships are staying out of port phase… my family decided it was time. We’ve always been rambling. But I was already ready to leave my job at the time.
Having sufficient education and experience helps to get a skilled work visa, but so does willingness to try and to take, in my case, a 50% pay cut.
It has been a great 5 years, and I wouldn’t trade it for the world.
Don't mind me I'm also looking through the replies, I'm not qualified to answer this question... I basically followed the trend and drifted from China to the US for education & thought I would have stayed permanently, but wow things went down the drain quickly (left before the ICE did their thing in Chicago...). I am still trying to figure out the new country (Belgium) I found a job and relocated to at the moment
Hope things are going well in Belgium!
I moved back to my home country from the USA. So glad I did. We're on the up and up and see no fascism in sight. We're getting plenty of gentrification driving up prices and displacing our locals, though... 🙄
I've been a digital nomad for almost 20 years now as a software engineer. It's by far the best way to live imo especially if you can have remote income. The world is incredible, there are so many places, so many cultures, so many people to connect with - living in a single location seems like missing out.
Trying to learn a FSI category 5 language when you don't have a dedicated language class is an ongoing and frustrating experience, but the cost of living is low, the countryside is peaceful, and going back to the states right now seems crazy.
https://www.state.gov/foreign-service-institute/foreign-language-training
I went to Pueblo Mexico at 18 on a youths mission trip. We worked at an orphanage, we dug/built a well and helped with a couple bigger projects like "renovation" a barn. We had learned some plays and songs and puppet shows and we performed for/with the children. It was with my church, it was Christian based. It was an amazing experience, I wouldn't trade it for anything.
I also went to Peru and sailed down the Amazon stopping at villages performing skits/plays/songs and prayed and fellowshipped with the locals. Ive done local out reaches too, providing food and services for the homeless.
My Christian life has been about serving others. As it should be IMO. God provides literally every I need, anything extra I try to use to bless other people.
That is Christianity. Not to toot my own horn, I dont need to, God will toot my horn :). Loving God and loving each other are literally the 2 most important things in this life. Anyway. If you read this, God bless you.
I went from US to UK. It was the easiest way out, as a dual citizen by birth. Still hard, with a baby and a wife in tow, neither UK citizens, during a pandemic. My job did a lot of legwork for me, incorporated a subsidiary in the UK for me to work here remotely.
Our families have only been American for roughly one generation so far (bar one or two grandparents), I'm just taking us back to one of our home countries, belatedly. Philippines seemed like a non-starter, as did Croatia. The UK has a lot of the same problems as the US, but at a different scale.
The craziest part was that until we emigrated, we'd never even been to the UK. But we had a certainty several years ago that America was going where we couldn't follow. I wish I could have travelled more, growing up.
I'd say it was worth it. I just wish I had more cards in my hand to choose from, or that the UK was still in the EU. Whole world's a mess these days though, just playing the hand I've been dealt.
Moved from Austria to the Netherlands at the age of 19. I moved in with my (then) boyfriend so that made the transition easier.
It was weirdly more of a culture shock than I had anticipated. Mainly because lots of things (besides the architecture) are so similar that the differences kind of sneak up on you. Having German and English as a base made Dutch easy enough. Got an advanced language certificate and ended up getting the nationality, found a study I liked and plenty of job opportunities. It has been over 15 years now and I regret nothing.
The only thing that didn’t work out was that relationship.
Moved from Germany to the Bay Area in 2017. Was an interesting experience, I now understand why they hate health insurance so much. Overall it wasn’t half as good as they make it out to be. We were lucky since we could afford it but I don’t want to live in that place.
Moved to Vancouver right before Covid hit and we’re not going to go back to Germany except to visit friends and family. It’s weird to see how conservative and backwards the whole country is and will forever be. With AFD on the rise and the overall negative attitude of Germans we don’t miss it one bit. Canada is much nicer and we’re dual citizens now 👍
My family moved from Mainland China to the US in around 2010. I was a kid so I did not have a choice, but I do remember being excited about it. When I got here, things were rough, language barrier, and ptsd lingering from my abusive older brother made it hard to socialize, I didn't have much friends. So I didn't like it too much at first, but I did like how there were just so much more trees even in the city (I mean not really city-city, more like suburban ourskirts of a City, Brooklyn I mean), air feels cleaner in the US, my mother thought the same too. I've grown too used to western media, I can never live in Mainland China ever again, the only options for me are now mostly other western countries lile Canada and Australia. As for the US, I liked it until November 2024, now it feels like a foreign army has invaded the country, doesn't feel very like "America" anymore. But I still prefer the US to Mainland China, even as of today.
My parents, even though they are PRC-Sympathizers (to clarify, they're NOT communists, just "homesick" I guess), never seriously talked about wanting to go back, dual citizenship doesn't exist in China, and my mother already got US citizenship so I don't know if PRC even restores revoked citizenships.
Was it worth it? I mean... idk, but I definitely had access to more entertainment content than I ever could in Mainland China, so in that aspect, yes, absolutely. I don't think I could've ever tolerated China, I mean, being practically the only person who has a sibling would be very weird (I'm the second child in my family born during one child policy), Hukou situation is messed up, Toxic Masculinity is 2x worse, massive corruption problems, food safety problems, child abductions/trafficking that authorities don't care about, the infamous 豆腐渣工程 (tofu-dreg)... it mean its absolutely just cooked.
(But then... November 2024 happened... So yea, the US is becoming like China all over again. Jesus christ, my life is torture, pretty sure this is a simulation and this is some High-Tech torture chamber by the Galactic Empire.)
TLDR: I wished it was Norway instead, but I'll accept US over mainland China.
Moved from the US to Germany in 2023 through my work (and the EU Blue Card). It has been life changing and I want to stay forever, eventually becoming a citizen and renouncing my US citizenship.
AMA
What has changed about your life?
So much!
The things that I immediately felt:
Those are the things I've felt most readily. But there have been numerous statistical improvements that I want to highlight:
All hoity toity now arentcha? We're glad your quality of life improved. Dont assume just because moving to Germany was great for you, it would be everyone, not that you claimed that, but i will pretend you did and argue against that. It wouldn't be so great for certain minorities, or any minority. Im a tone, handsome white male with a certain Germanic look, so, id be a perfect fit. Im what they consider an "übermench".
I don't know if I'm going for hoity toity, I apologize if I did. I will say I am going for, or experiencing and processing loudly, an angry place of "everything could be better if we got loud and violent" so there is a little intentionality to me being like "I got the same job at the same company in a different county and everything miraculously got better, imagine if you also formed a union and demanded things" or a basic and passive rebuttal to the "if you pay kitchen staff and waiters what they're worth food prices would sky rocket and there'd be general anarchy and blah blah blah.
You're right to say I wasn't assuming it'd be better for everyone. I'm aware there is some problematic racism and sexism and classism here. That being said, statistically most people would be better off here even if dealing with those -ism's. Not like the US doesn't have its fair share of systemic and personal representations of those -ism's. There's plenty of Indian, Turkish, Asian, etc people here so it's not exactly unlivable as you sorta suggest. Most people, regardless of color, religion, or sexuality do fine here and are safe. Always room for improvement and in this case (as in most countries everywhere right now) massive room. But that's not here or there, I'm not recommending everyone move to Germany. I'm recommending everyone in the US read what I'm saying and realize that things could be drastically better and that it could happen overnight if the people fought for it. The fighting itself would take time of course, and this is an ideal thought experiment, but the point stands there is no reason the US doesn't have an average of 30 paid holidays per worker, or free healthcare, or public transit, or or or... We have the technology and the money and will, we just need the power.
I agree, we should have free health, public transit thats worth a shit, free higher education. If it wasnt for greed, things could be/ would be so much better for everyone.
I live by Christian principles as much as I possibly can, and greed is obviously a cardinal destructive sin. Greed has been the root cause of so much suffering through out time and civilizations. Im always blessed and my needs are always met. I dont think its greedy to want to live nice and live comfortably, thats what God wants for us. He wants that we should be blessed more than we can even handle. But remember to have a giving spirit if God has given to you.
Moved from the US to the Netherlands in 2023 and regret nothing. The opportunity came in the form of the Dutch-American Friendship Treaty. It makes it ridiculously easy for Americans to move to the Netherlands, if you are self employed. It worked for me to move, and when my business went sideways due to my main client screwing me over, I got a normal Dutch job as a highly-skilled migrant.
Downsides:
Benefits:
There's probably more benefits, but those are the highlights for me. All around though, the biggest advantage is that I can easily see a much better future for myself and my wife in the Netherlands than I can in the US.
This is an amazing rundown and I can appreciate how most of the downsides are food-based.
I can tell my boss I'm sick and that's that.
This is huge, it's exhausting to have to deal with the fallout of calling in sick that I sometimes work through it so I don't have to deal with the bs.
Edited formatting
I almost asked my boss like 20 years ago while I was vacationing near Amsterdam with my girlfriend-now-wife about moving to The Netherlands as we had an office there, but never did. Still wonder how different life would have turned out. It’s an amazing country.
A company was willing to sponsor my visa and pay for relocation costs. Was it worth it? In some other world it might have been, but the way it went for me - absolutely not.
If your entry point into a society is work, make really really sure you will like it. "Culture fit", despite all the criticisms of the concept, is more important than ever. And make sure the initial social circle you fall into is conductive to your mental wellbeing.
In some ways it's like being born. Your starting point matters. Anything you achieved previously doesn't matter since your entire support system will be gone.
All you say depends heavily on where you came from and where you went, but also what job you got. Which is quite clear from the post and yet you mentioned nothing of that.
Do you want to elaborate?
and they were never seen again
Well, not much else to say. Actually a lot more to say but to a therapist. I made some really bad choices in life, and suffered the consequences. A rags to riches to rags story.
Giving more specific details would go into doxxing territory.
Hey, I did that!
Engineer in my 30s. We packed up and left the US after I got a job in the EU (pre 2nd trump). It's been awesome!
Super hard some days, lots of learning, cultural norming, work, job problems, language learning, social circle building, but it's very fulfilling and I think it's a better lifestyle fit for us.
Highly recommend it if you can swing it. And if you do, jump all in.
I was offered a job that payed much better than my old one. So I'd say it's well worth it.
Downside is that it takes years to build up a new social circle when you're in late 30s (might vary with personality).
Moved from EU to US during Trump1/just before COVID. Loved the pay check, the weather and the nature, hated the work culture, the food culture, the lack of culture, the lack of a social net and of social cohesion, the ingrained racism.
Moved from US to Germany, liked it but didn’t love it. Loved to social net and the beer gardens, the parks and public transport, struggled making connections and learning the language.
Moved from Germany to France, loved it. Great food, great weather, good work life balance, great social net, amazing food and good culture, people are friendly and welcoming (not in Paris or overly touristy places). Only downside is being away from family and having to build my social circle again.
You don't think French do weird shit all the time?
Maybe you are French yourself.
Not French, but from nearby. Culturally very similar. I really understood how much cultural expectations are deeply ingrained, and how much they play a tole in making me feel “at home”.
There are still things that French people do that I find odd, but not overly much, and more in a cute way than an annoying one.
I moved for work. I jokingly asked my boss one day if I could relocate and did not expect an easy yes. 2 years after asking, I was in another country. Was it worth it? Yes. It was a once in a lifetime opportunity and not many people get the chance, so I took it. I didn't even care what city I was going to end up in (we have multiple offices in across the country).
I did end up in a different city than what was initially planned, but for someone in my situation (wanting to get out of a 3rd world country), beggars can't be choosers. I've since settled in with my wife. Assimilating wasn't an issue because my home country is very exposed to western culture and we're fluent in the language.
Moved from San diego, CA, USA, to tijuana, BC, Mexico. Literally just drive across the border and find somewhere to rent.
I still drive to San Diego to work every day.
I had a friend who lived that way for years in Baja, just went over for work and went home, loved it there.
I'm receiving tech patent royalties and moved with wife to France. I have lived in Malaysia and Singapore and a little time in Spain before this.
Our life didn't change much, but we have a new baby and the constant back and forth of us politics makes it no longer a good investment for me in the US. We don't want to worry about shootings and extremists and corporations allowed to steal from us and worrying about taking a baby to the emergency department because of costs. Food is miles better, healthcare is great and affordable even not yet being covered by the national scheme. I'm clearing out my real estate and investments in the US and going to start again in France. Making friends, especially french friends, is slow, but to be fair we haven't had time to invest in and participate in our hobbies. I'm sure when we do we will find our people (french lessons will help too). I am happy to pay the extra tax and social charges to preserve the system here as it is.
Pros: far better and cheaper food, weather where we are in the south is great, cars expensive but affordable, much less driving but I still own a car, great schools and accessible healthcare. Cheaper rent, and cheaper house prices. I also personally agree with the very real concept of egality in France- everyone is treated the same.
Cons: things take longer here, some rules and rights aren't quite as good as elsewhere in Europe because France is a bit conservative in some ways. Situations not within the normal permanent work contract in France and background in France can sometimes complicate things. Pay would be less if I had a local job, but I don't think my life would be negatively impacted much.
I would say it was worth it. I moved from the Netherlands to Germany for three years for a Master's and then to Canada for a PhD and stayed there and got a job. It's a great way to experience different cultures (though all Western of course).
For the move to Germany, it was really easy. It's all EU so all I had to really do was register at the Kreisverwaltungsreferat. I had also applied for a grant to study abroad so that paid the tuition as well as the rent. Tuition in Germany is very low by the way. It was also a great way to build independence since I had to rely a lot on myself, having come all alone.
I did meet my lovely Canadian spouse there, so there was the opportunity to move to yet another country. Immigration is a massive pain, even when married to a Canadian, but it all worked out with student visa, permanent resident, and finally citizen. Took years!
The downside is of course being 6000km away from my family. Especially from my parents who are not getting any younger. So it's hard to be there for them if something happens. But overall, I would say it was worth it. The experiences have been great and I get to spread ideas that work well from places I've been to my new home in Canada. The lack of proper licorice here is baffling though!
I live in rural Canada, our local (left coast) grocery has the palm-oil-free NZ licorice RJ’s, which is pretty good, and a specialty confectionery in the village nearby has some great icelandic licorice but it’s expensive.
But at 6K km I guess you are on the prairies, so good luck on the licorice hunt eh!
I was able to move to the country my wife grew up in - she, as a citizen, sponsored my visa. We moved from an area with relatively high real estate cost (sold for over $1mil - we had a mortgage, but also significant equity) to an area where it's much, much, cheaper (bought for about $100k currency corrected) so we could retire early - we're both ~60.
