this post was submitted on 20 Dec 2023
325 points (97.4% liked)
Futurology
1856 readers
55 users here now
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Working people would also get UBI. Most likely taxes would go up, making their paycheck smaller. But then they're getting UBI. Ideally this would result in the majority of stable, permanent workers getting the same pay from 2 different sources. With richer people getting less and poorer people getting more.
Lots of workers would stop working, and that's OK. That will mean certain industries will have to pay more. UBI will result in people working just to not starve or die of exposure a thing of the past. And let me tell you, capitalists and business with FIGHT this to hell and back. It removes a huge cudgel from workers.
But more realistically, UBI will probably start with a below-basic income level subsidy for homeless and jobless to help house and keep people in houses. Kind of like unemployment, but it actually works long-term.
I'm fully aware friend. I'm not arguing the merits, multiple successful studies, or the desperate need.
My point is how do we convince the poor, deluded, beaten dog people to vote for leaders promising to enact this policy? Can't you already hear the ignorant screams of "TROJAN HORSE COMMUNISM!!!!!" Yes, fully aware its not.
How do we sell this on a bumper sticker? A paragraph won't help with most Americans.
Ah, sorry. I wasn't replying against your comment but trying to add my ideas/explanation to it and the idea of UBI.
My only ideas on how to convince Americans aren't great: that UBI will prevent homelessness both of them and probably prevent people sleeping on the streets. It'll prevent hunger which means no real risk of not being able to feed your kids. Overall it'll prevent some desperation so it'll prevent a lot of the causes of crime.
Buuuut that won't convince the majority of Americans who think it could never happen to them. Honestly we'll probably get universal healthcare before UBI and I'm not holding out hope to see that in my lifetime. :(
Even worse, I got conservatives in my family I know will say "but those people deserve to be there. They made bad decisions and should suffer for them." Even though the "bad decision" premise is bullshit before we get into the cruelty of "deserving" suffering.
To those conservatives: Since the far and away best indicator of a person's wealth is how wealthy their parents were, I guess that means that poor people deserve to be born from poor parents, huh?
Conservatives don't care about facts.
Well when Republicans didn't want to forgive even $10k worth of student loans cuz it's "not fair to the people who paid it off" I'm not too optimistic we could convince them of UBI
it isn't really fair..... so you make public trade schools, public technical colleges, and undergrad at a public college or university free, too.
'here. go (back) to school, paid for by the wealthy.'
It wouldn't be paid for by the wealthy. The wealthy only take, i.e. take all of the value created by the working. Have you seen how much goes in subsidies to private businesses to enhance their private business. That weath could pay for it, it's where the wealthy get all their money.
And great point about education being public and freely available. It's beneficial on so many levels.
Shit, on that particular issue, there were swaths of neoliberals who ignorantly locked arms with conservatives in screaming "no fair!"