this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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300 million lbs of fireworks and 2.7 billion dollars gone in a cloud of smoke.

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[–] Xantar@lemmy.dbzer0.com 47 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

Yup, that could also be said about music, cinema and any other form of art/entertainment/distraction. It doesn't produce anything "useful", but again, what is "useful" varies from one person to another. Some would say the waste of money is the point. You blow fireworks because you can.

Ultimately nothing matters because there is no true meaning of life, so anything that pulls you away from the dark nothingness of existence is good to take.

[–] rodbiren@midwest.social 34 points 3 months ago (7 children)

I can't think of other art forms that blow off the hands of so many people, wake up my daughter in terror at 11PM, and make both dogs and veterans suffer for an extended period of time. I'm fine with the large group spectacle that is planned and controlled. What I can't stand is the widespread uncontrollable nonsense of just anyone buying them and setting them off at any hour on the 4th. Law enforcement can do absolutely nothing about it. I'm just gonna have to deal with it. I'm just surprised we haven't collectively shifted to something less harmful.

[–] illi@lemm.ee 17 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Not just dogs or other pets, but also farm and wild animals. And it may not only lead to suffering, but also lead to their deaths.

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[–] A_Union_of_Kobolds@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

That's what I'm saying. One day we'll look back in amazement that we let the public buy fireworks willy-nilly. Even the "it was good enough for me!" crowd of angry old-timers will have to go "Well, yeah, people blowed they hands off. And it bothered my veteran son and the neighbor's dogs somethin fierce. They're alright. It's prolly fer the best."

Now, I fully admit later today I will be running around in a country field with my friends shooting bottle rockets at each other. But we won't be bothering SOMEONE ELSE, and that's my thing.

[–] ramble81@lemm.ee 4 points 3 months ago

Except fireworks has literally been a part of civilization for 1,000 plus years, so I don’t see that changing anytime soon.

[–] intensely_human@lemm.ee 2 points 3 months ago

One day we’ll look back in amazement that we let people have sex willy nilly and bond with whomever they like on a whim, forming friendships and families without central oversight.

But that doesn’t mean that future we’ll be looking back from in amazement won’t be a dystopian nightmare, or that our perspective won’t be warped by even more decades of infantilization.

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[–] Grayox@lemmy.ml 6 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yeah but none of them are anywhere near as ephemeral as a firework display.

[–] Xantar@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

That doesn't make them more/less worth it.

If your criteria for worthiness is persistence then is a nice looking meal as worth it as equally nutritious goop ?

[–] Thavron@lemmy.ca 6 points 3 months ago (1 children)
[–] Land_Strider@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago

There's nothing to be afraid of.

[–] blazera@lemmy.world 35 points 3 months ago (3 children)

Fireworks are a cool spectacle, imagine never seeing a fireworks show. Also the money isnt gone, its just changed hands.

They probably shouldnt be how they are now though, where every individual family wants to fire their own, thats a waste and really obnoxious when its in the middle of neighborhoods. Keep it to one centralized show, away from residential areas, and everyone gets to watch a bigger show.

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[–] YaBoyMax@programming.dev 18 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Can't you say the same about virtually any form of entertainment? The electricity that runs the server you used to post this doesn't come from nowhere.

[–] qaz@lemmy.world 8 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

I don't think this is a fair comparison. Fireworks launch a lot of nanoparticles, metals, and other harmful chemicals in the sky and directly worsen air quality while lemmy.world's servers use renewable energy.

[–] Modern_medicine_isnt@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago (2 children)

The materials to make the servers don't come from nowhere. And the processes to get those materials are often very polluting.

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[–] fadingembers@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 3 months ago (4 children)

As a veteran with PTSD, I agree

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[–] Crackhappy@lemmy.world 17 points 3 months ago (3 children)

I have a dog who would agree. If he could speak English (he's from Mexico).

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[–] StrawberryPigtails@lemmy.sdf.org 17 points 3 months ago

Of course they are a waste of money, and the plastic packaging is incredibly bad for the environment. And they are fun and I will buy them again next year.

[–] Modern_medicine_isnt@lemmy.world 17 points 3 months ago

The long and the short of it is that we live in a society of different people who enjoy different things. Nearly everything is a trade off of some sort. Some people value the enjoyment they get from fireworks more than others. Some hate it. That is true of litterally everything. I strongly dislike the keeping of pets on anything smaller than a farm. But I don't tell people they shouldn't have pets. Being part of a society means living with a mix of things you like and don't. And the society determines what is so commonly disliked that it should be not allowed by the law. Now many will say the fireworks are illegal in a lot of places. Yes so is speeding. Our system has three parts, the laws, the enforcement, and the penalties. Enforcement of fireworks laws are often pretty lax, same with speeding. And the penalties are almost always purely monetary. So society has said it doesn't really care that much about fireworks. And the large number of people who use them and who show up to fireworks shows backs that up.

[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 16 points 3 months ago (5 children)

Waste of money? No more so than any other form of entertainment that is temporary.

Environmentally, yeah…they’re pretty bad. Air pollution is a big issue. Some birds get killed when they run into things because they can’t see very well after being scared off by the fireworks. Any large human event is environmentally bad, like a sporting event.

We generate literal tons of plastic and other human waste when we gather for mass entertainment.

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[–] FellowEnt@sh.itjust.works 14 points 3 months ago

I think they're amazing. The chemistry of colored flame has fascinated me since I was young, and there's nothing quite like being close to explosions. If I had more time and lived in the US I'd be a hobby pyrotechnician.

[–] neomachino@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 3 months ago (2 children)

I hate fireworks and always have. I get people like them, but I wish they didn't go all night from every direction. If each area had a central park/spot where they did a big firework show for everyone for a little bit I wouldn't mind it as much, but now every street has they're own fireworks that go off randomly through the night.

Also something I don't think a lot of people think about. In my old neighborhood a lot of us had varying forms on PTSD and couldn't deal with the loud bangs. Holidays where fireworks were heavy were treated as a ceasefire/peace day for the most part since basically everyone who had been involved in a shooting was a mess, which was almost everyone. Others took the chance to disrespect that and use the fireworks as cover, they weren't treated well.

I'm sure most veterans feel the same or worse.

It's not just dogs who lose it at fireworks.

[–] Modern_medicine_isnt@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago

I'll disagree on the "most veterans" part. The people who I know who fire off the most and biggest fireworks are vets. They seem to be more comfortable around explosives, or just more used to it. I don't know which.

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[–] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)

i think fireworks are nice but they're to a large degree something from a different age and at this point we should only really be using smaller volcano-style ones, and like holy shit we have drone technology, why aren't drone displays standard in any vaguely populated area?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lnBmYAiduo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyEWcfn7rT0

look at this shit, it's so cool! can we please push for this to be the standard?

[–] anon6789@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago

Good news then!

NPR: Why drone light shows are replacing traditional July 4th fireworks

Cities like Napa, Calif., and Salt Lake City, Utah, have opted out of traditional pyrotechnics this year. They say they're worried about pollution and the risk of wildfires, so instead, they'll create a tribute to America with a light show made by drones.

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[–] Novamdomum@kbin.run 7 points 3 months ago (4 children)

Fireworks are a funny one because you're completely right and also not completely right I think. It's one of those unresolvable dichotomies of life where two opposing ideas are both true at the same time. I've often thought fireworks were the most obvious way to set fire to a lot of money that could be better used somewhere else. However, what is also true is that humans have a deep need to celebrate and to come together in large groups and have shared experiences. Fireworks are perfect for that. You can put a million people together and launch a massive firework display and they will all immediately connect with each other through the shared experience of going "Oooooohh" and "Aaaaaaahh" :) Fireworks are awesome and also, personally I feel they remind me that there are bigger things out there than the daily grind of existence.

[–] NocturnalMorning@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

humans have a deep need to celebrate and to come together in large groups and have shared experiences

Isn't that what parades are for?

personally I feel they remind me that there are bigger things out there than the daily grind of existence

There are other ways to get that. The universe is huge, look up on a quiet night with little light pollution.

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[–] penguinsAreRapists@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago

My city had a drone show this year and it kinda sucked. I probably won't go again

[–] souperk@reddthat.com 6 points 3 months ago

They also scare the crap out of my dog, and cause a lot of accidents. Though, they can be beautiful...

[–] daniskarma@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 3 months ago

I'm ok with professional firework shows.

I'm not ok for every kid in the neighborhood having access to little explosives.

[–] JohnDClay@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 months ago (2 children)

For pollution, at least CO2, 300M lb is 136k metric tons. I didn't know the water to CO2 ratio for solid rocket motors, but I'd guess maybe half is CO2. Cars produce 1.5B tons of CO2 per year in the US, so the CO2 would be about equivalent to about 24 min of driving cars. That doesn't seem too unreasonable.

But maybe you were taking about the metals? I don't know how much of an issue those are.

[–] someguy3@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago (9 children)

Unfortunately this isn't complete combustion. There's a shit ton of PM and everything else. Ever go to a big show? They have to take pauses for the smoke to clear so that you can see the next batch.

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[–] MindTraveller@lemmy.ca 2 points 3 months ago

The metals are a big thing. Breathing heavy metals is bad for people and animals.

[–] fmstrat@lemmy.nowsci.com 4 points 3 months ago (2 children)

The art of it has use. However I think drone shows would be an interesting replacement.

[–] oce@jlai.lu 2 points 3 months ago (13 children)

Are drones really less pollution than fireworks?

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[–] Feathercrown@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Several other people feel this way and you're all wrong. Is good food wasted because after you eat it it's gone? Are vacations stupid because once it's over nothing has materially changed? No? So why are fireworks pointless simply because they're temporary?

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[–] SexualPolytope@lemmy.sdf.org 3 points 3 months ago

I'm not totally against fireworks. As others have mentioned, sometimes we do need to just have some fun and not worry about the consequences. But they should be done far from residential area, so that unwilling people (e.g. vets, children, or pets) aren't disturbed. (Honestly though, I wish we didn't have any vets with PTSD, that's the worse problem. As long as we still have wars, I'd say let the people have some fun.)

[–] Boozilla@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (3 children)

They seem very backwards when there are drone displays and other forms of entertainment. Humans cling on to things way too long.

[–] ChexMax@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (2 children)

I think a big part of it is that they're dangerous. It's fun to experience just a tinge of fear from how big they sound, or even just from being near the little street versions. It's a (relatively) safe way for us to experience something that would otherwise be terror inducing explosives.

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[–] watersnipje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 3 months ago

So many injuries and fires every year, aside from all the noise and pollution. My friend’s house (old farm) burned down because a firework landed on the roof :(

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