this post was submitted on 08 May 2025
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[–] markovs_gun@lemmy.world 9 points 20 hours ago

Depends on what you mean by "low." At a certain level low enough IQ is associated with intellectual disability, and a difficulty functioning in society. IQ is normalized so half of people have, by definition, an IQ lower than 100, and half have an IQ above 100. 15 points is a standard deviation, so about 68% of people fall between 85 and 115, and the remaining 32% fall within the "tails". I assume by "Low IQ" you would mean the ~16% of the population below 85 IQ, and probably the ~13.5% that fall in the range of 70-85, as below 70 is getting into intellectual disability territory.

Statistically, people in this band do worse in just about every metric for social success. Lower income, higher crime rates, higher rates of drug addiction, poorer health outcomes, etc. However, it is difficult to disentangle these impacts from poverty. Populations' IQs raise when they become less poor, and people regardless of income tend to be less poor if they have higher IQs. The cycle of poverty is deeply intertwined with IQ, and poverty causes a lot of the social issues associated with low IQ. There is a lot of evidence that as access to education and a more "intellectually rich" upbringing increase IQ, and such things are less available to poor people for a variety of reasons.

As for what it's like, from my understanding speaking to people I suspect are in this band the main things are a non-inquisitive world view, a sense of resignation around not understanding abstract concepts, and low self esteem associated with these perceived shortcomings. Society does not treat these people kindly as a whole, and I think that we could all stand to be kinder to one another. I also think that our economic system is geared in such a way that not only are low IQ people punished for that, but they are also made to feel that it is a personal shortcoming even though these things are defined statistically such that there is always a group of people at the bottom who are going to be left behind.

[–] Yermaw@lemm.ee 10 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

I'm not stupid stupid, but I'm a lot less intelligent now than I was as a child. Not sure if that's standard growing-up stuff or other factors. I think I'm average now, but I used to be really quite smart.

Whatevers to blame, it sucks. I struggle to remember names of people/things/processes, or things to do today. I go through the day based on vibes. I look at a page of information, or a tedious form to fill in, and it's physically uncomfortable to slog through it. I can feel my brain groaning, there's tension and anxiety in my body. Frustration that this should be so easy and instead I'm having to actually concentrate.

[–] justsquigglez@lemm.ee 14 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 22 hours ago)

I'll be honest man, this doesn't sound like "Low IQ", it sounds like maybe a mental disorder that you haven't been able to treat yet (ADHD is the first one to come to mind.)

I say that because I can relate a bit, but I have been formally diagnosed with ADHD. I would maybe look into the symptoms of that and others and you might be surprised to find that you relate to it.

You're not stupid because you can't concentrate, just my two cents 🤙

(I would also argue that a "Low IQ" individual wouldn't necessarily be able to recognize the issues you describe.)

[–] ininewcrow@lemmy.ca 121 points 1 day ago (6 children)

You get to lead the most powerful nation in the world

[–] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 8 points 1 day ago

"Must be at least this rich to ride"

[–] knee_deep@r.nf 5 points 1 day ago

I read that as lead, not lead.

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[–] bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de 10 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Long Covid with ME has made me increasingly dumber. It sucks bad. I have difficulty finding words, following conversations, understanding long texts and just plain remembering things. It's devastating to be more stupid but knowing that you could do better.

Just a few minutes ago I said I couldn't play Leisure Suit Larry 7 because it's too hard. Sucks ass.

[–] ryannathans@aussie.zone 6 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

I don't think brain fog is the same as being dumb though

[–] bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de 4 points 22 hours ago (1 children)
[–] SlippiHUD@lemmy.world 3 points 19 hours ago

As a fellow sufferer of Covid Brain Fog, it is being dumb.

Even if it's temporary, which so far hasn't shaken out that way for me. I am currently the dumbest I have ever been.

The amount of things I used to do for fun that I now have had to quit or hire out to others because I can't do it anymore is deeply demoralizing and frustrating. It feels like a part of my identity has been stolen from me.

[–] tetris11@lemmy.ml 89 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (4 children)

You're always playing catchup when in a conversation with others; they're racing ahead on the topic, already knowing both sides of the discussion and throwing their own spin on it, and you're just sitting there staring at them mouth-agape as you try to process what is being said in realtime, but can't quite grasp even the base concepts nor the terminology of what they're talking about because their shop talk is so far removed from the baseline that it's practically a whole subject in itself.

The smart thing to do is to just interject quickly with simple questions to highlight your supposed ignorance, and get some quick definitions to keep you at least somewhat up-to-date in the conversation.

But you don't... either too ashamed of your own ignorance to draw attention to it, or rejecting it outright instead of facing the humiliation and telling yourself that you're not that interested in the topic anyway.

That's how it feels to me, anyhow

[–] tanisnikana@lemmy.world 39 points 1 day ago

Honestly, that’s a nuanced take on the nature of conversation. I’m sure you’ve got a good head, you’re just not a nerd like them.

[–] flubba86@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago

This is simply a symptom of not being experienced in or knowledgeable in the topic of the conversation.

Not being knowledgeable, or not being smart, is unrelated to IQ. Knowing a great deal about a topic or field is not the same as having a high IQ.

[–] comfy@lemmy.ml 12 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

For what it's worth, I'm very familiar with that feeling too, despite excelling academically and a high score on IQ tests. Ignorance is not a lack of intelligence, it's more likely a lack of experience. And every culture, job and hobby will have their own terminology and assumed knowledge, so not even the Einsteins could pretend to already know it all.

I listen to music all the time, I've composed amateur music myself, and enjoy occasionally reading wikipedia for trivia of music theory, but if two musicians start talking about basic stuff like major and minor chords I'm already out of my depth. Do I do the smart thing and ask them to explain? Or do I just nod until they talk about something I know, or tell myself I don't actually care about music theory?

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[–] mukt@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 day ago
[–] golden_zealot@lemmy.ml 50 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

There was a guy on youtube once who uploaded a video talking about this who has the channel name "crazydumbsick".

Unfortunately I can't seem to find the video as it looks like he regularly deletes content, and it currently only goes back about a month on his channel at present.

Take everything below with a block of salt because this is from memory, and it was a few years back where I watched his video once, so I could be misremembering one or more things here.

If I recall correctly he has Schizophrenia, Crohns, and an IQ of ~45, hence his channel name. He talked a lot about how hard it was to live, particularly pertaining to his IQ. He said that he has a hard time with remembering things and therefore most of his meals are made from pre-made microwaveable packages as he is capable of operating the microwave without too much difficulty, and he found it generally easy to follow the instructional lists on the packaging.

He made note that operating any kind of machine much beyond a microwave or TV remote was largely beyond him, except his computer and camera which he had recently figured out well enough to be able to record and upload content - but outside of those actions, he really had no idea how to use them.

I believe he also said that due to one or more of his conditions, he could not drive, which largely compounded the difficulties of his life.

He talked about how finding work for someone in his situation is basically impossible and just as impossible to hold onto for very long. I believe he talked about a couple jobs he had been fired from and why, and while I don't recall the specifics, I believe he had talked about how he was not even entirely certain why he had been fired. I think he said that he had done some things incorrectly, and at the time, had some vague concept of them being incorrect, but despite this, he was unsure why he had gone ahead and done them anyway.

Overall, he seemed very sad in the video; he was terribly aware of how hard it is to live life being himself, and knew that there were basically no solutions to it.

Having said all of that, he continued to upload videos and there were some good events and some bad events. I believe at one or more times he discussed having tried to take his own life. Other times he seemed fairly upbeat and was trying to better himself - trying to read through a textbook on auto work for example.

Anyway, I think the original video I spoke about is one of the better videos I've seen uploaded to the internet. It was somewhat sad, but it was highly enlightening and certainly one of the most honest videos I've ever seen someone upload.

[–] ItsMeForRealNow@lemmy.world 19 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Too highbrow, gtfo smarty smart man.

[–] Sandouq_Dyatha@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 day ago

if you believe in IQ tests you're already an expert

[–] Zeppo@sh.itjust.works 25 points 1 day ago

In my experience, people are generally unaware of current events and history. They don't understand basic math. They are very poor at critical reasoning and don't comprehend things like evidence or facts, so they're easily convinced by hunches or baseless claims prominent people make.

[–] StenSaksTapir@feddit.dk 3 points 23 hours ago

It's great! You always have full confidence in yourself, your actions and your convictions.

[–] ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world 16 points 1 day ago (1 children)

If you’re using IQ as a measure of intelligence, you probably already know.

[–] jsomae@lemmy.ml 17 points 1 day ago

They didn't ask about intelligence, they asked about IQ.

[–] PunkRockSportsFan@fanaticus.social 19 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I bet it’s fucking awesome.

Some idiot says “this is how things work” (and explains things in a way that aren’t true at all)

And then I’d be like “yeah that’s good enough for me.”

And I’d watch sports and not be worrying all the time.

As it is, I unfortunately see through most bullshit and realize im surrounded by people who don’t.

I am the scientist at the beginning of every disaster movie. Ignored until it is too late. Then blamed.

[–] loudWaterEnjoyer@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

What do you mean with "IQ"?

[–] snek_boi@lemmy.ml 1 points 19 hours ago

Intelligence quotient. A bunch of people take a test and they’re compared to each other. Your result is your intelligence quotient.

Its origins were noble, because it was designed to identify students who needed extra help in school. The creator of the test knew that people could change their results with good instruction. However, that noble origin story was besmirched by what happened later. Eventually, IQ tests were used as a way to classify people in more brutal and rigid ways. The USA military used it as a cutoff for aspiring cadets. USA colleges use tests that effectively are IQ tests to let people in or not. The worst part is that bigots around the world injected pseudoscience into IQ and used it to decide who they think are worthy of life and who aren’t. It’s as awful as it sounds.

You may notice that helping struggling students sounds wonderful, and you may think that we should go back to that.

However, some people believe that tests aren’t useful at all to tell us something about anything. They believe IQ tests should be banished and never used.

Others people believe IQ tests are a snapshot of how a person answered the questions to a test in a given day. Additionally, these people notice that, in research, IQ scores are robustly associated with other things, such as quality of relationships, happiness, income, and other measures. These results suggest that learning to solve problems helps humans solve problems!

If the noble origins of the test are a guide, poor performers would receive help. More people would get the benefits of a higher IQ, not because of the fear of being classified in a brutal and rigid way, but because a good education makes the mind curious, nimble, and open.

[–] kreskin@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

if it gets low enough that you dont understand how bad off you are, its apparently not that bad.

[–] Nemo@slrpnk.net 7 points 1 day ago

Why are you asking us? You're the expert.

nyuk nyuk nyuk

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 22 hours ago

They will never get past the join lemmy page when it starts talking about federation. So there is no point asking that here.

[–] hanrahan@slrpnk.net 2 points 1 day ago
[–] thezeesystem@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Low IQ is a type of singling people out who are not what society wants people to be. A form of subtle eugenics, make the "dumb" people not be able to do things because a "test" says there IQ is low, for instance someone who speaks another language could mis understand the "test" and people think there idiots when in fact they just wasn't good at English. This also goes for people who are absolutely horrible at English reading and comprehension of "tests" when they could be brilliant in other aspects of life.

So remember there is no way to "test" how smart or dumb someone is.

[–] thepreciousboar@lemm.ee 2 points 23 hours ago

IQ does not measure intelligence, it measures different fields of intellect, mostly about logic, language comprehension and memory. It doesn't measure intelligence per se, but if you have a low score <70, you can be sure your life is going to be impacted negatively in some way, either because you don't understand other people, you don't understand the world or you cannot chain together complex logical chains.

[–] jsomae@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Unless you're saying other metrics on people are also somehow eugenics like height, weight, or speed, IQ is not eugenics. Eugenics is the belief that one's genes affects one's life, and certain genes will lead to a better life in expectation. (This is in fact a true belief, since there are some genes which are known to cause horrible painful short lives.)

IQ is just a measure of how well you do on an IQ test, which is known to correlate (maybe causally, maybe not) with various things such as income.

How do you know there is no way to test how smart or dumb somebody is? Even if IQ tests aren't to your standard, you can't be sure there isn't another test possible.

[–] howrar@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 day ago (3 children)

You would first need to define intelligence before you can measure it. We're still nowhere near any kind of agreement on that first step.

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[–] bastion@feddit.nl 3 points 1 day ago
[–] SpookyBogMonster@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 day ago (3 children)
[–] jsomae@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Only if you're naïve about IQ and worship it like God. Here is wikipedia's second paragraph on IQ:

Scores from intelligence tests are estimates of intelligence. Unlike, for example, distance and mass, a concrete measure of intelligence cannot be achieved given the abstract nature of the concept of "intelligence". IQ scores have been shown to be associated with such factors as nutrition, parental socioeconomic status, morbidity and mortality, parental social status, and perinatal environment. While the heritability of IQ has been investigated for nearly a century, there is still debate about the significance of heritability estimates and the mechanisms of inheritance. Current best estimates for heritability range from 40 to 60% of the variance between individuals in IQ being explained by genetics.

None of that stands out to me as particularly controversial, certainly not pseudoscience. Emphasis on second sentence -- it's not a concrete measure of intelligence.

[–] absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Great response.

The assertion that IQ is pseudoscience, is denying reality. While not an exact measure, it correlates with a lot of other measures of flourishing.

But higher IQ doesn't necessarily mean happier, or better in any way.

I know some extremely (academically) intelligent people. Some are arrogant pricks, others are really pleasant, others still are really awkward and difficult to talk to outside their specific interests.

[–] jsomae@lemmy.ml 1 points 19 hours ago

Well yeah, nothing is guaranteed. It's just a correlation -- higher IQ people tend to have more success. More success doesn't necessarily mean happier. But personally, I would take more success if given the option.

[–] Greg@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 day ago

ChatGDT said I had a 135 IQ, does that mean I’m also a pseudoscientist?

[–] Plebcouncilman@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

All psychology is.

Not saying it isn’t useful before a psych major jumps on me. But the entire field is basically explaining how to cope with a society that is hostile to human nature.

[–] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 5 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The entire field isn't therapy.

[–] Plebcouncilman@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

That’s about its only useful contribution.

[–] snek_boi@lemmy.ml 1 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago)

How to learn better? How to organize teams better? How to write text or make presentations so that it aligns with how the brain best receives information? How to evaluate candidates for a role while minimizing the halo effect and the bandwagon effect? How to nudge people into leaving public spaces cleaner? How to make spaces more attractive for people to spend time in? How to increase adherence to lifestyle changes such as diet and exercise after cancer treatment? How to increase the odds of achieving a task you want to do? How to make computer interfaces easier to use for people, including people with disabilities? You’re saying that psychology has not studied these nor contributed to them?

Yes, there are a lot of problems in the field. But there are also brilliant people cutting through the bullshit and using their findings to improve the world. I’d be more than happy to show you robust findings that the field has gifted the world.

[–] InternetCitizen2@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago
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