this post was submitted on 25 Sep 2025
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Remind me, which browser is Cloudlfare making?
did i ever make that claim or imply it anywhere?
You compared the Cloudflare situation to "taking money from Google" and added that due to Ladybird taking money from Cloudflare, they're "not challenging the status quo".
Ladybird being a browser has absolutely no bearing on webhosting and the only status quo it can challenge is in the browser market. Which implies that you think Cloudflare has something to do with the browser market.
i compared it to firefox, saying sucking up to oligarchies for money gets you tied up with them and prevents you from challenging them.
no use in challenging "the browser market" when you are getting funded by the very same actors keeping it the way it is.
Again: what does Cloudflare have to do with the browser market...?
they monopolize the internet infratructure. they can very well be the ones enforcing mainstream browsers.
and they do. they challenge firefox users much more when they have adblockers on and such. they have the capability to do more.
And you don't think that financing a third party browser to break the duopoly is "doing more"?
the duopoly that reigns the internet is google and cloudflare. this changes nothing.
This is like saying "the duopoly that reigns the water is Maersk and Smartwater", two companies that do completely different things that just happen to be related to water...
cloudflare rules the infrastructure in the middle, google rules both ends as it controls the browser and some of the code that runs on the backend.
you are making a nonsensical comparison.
Mate, we're talking about the BROWSER MARKET.
Even assuming Ladybird somehow gains 100% of that market, completely kicking out anything Chromium related, it has ZERO bearing on who people choose for their host! Cloudflare currently has around 20% of that market, and if Ladybird - today - goes up to 100% share of the browser market, Cloudflare will still hold 20% of hosting!
You're talking about some overarching Internet revolution, while the thread is about a single aspect of how people reach the Internet!
browsers are not a market in themselves, browsers are used to browse the internet. they are irrelevant without the context around it.
if google or cloudflare decide to create some bullshit attestation system to lock alternatives out and vendors adopt it, it doesn't matter how many options you have. and they seem to be scoping out how to do just that.
Google's Chrome used to be only about 60% compliant with W3C guidelines. They still became the de-facto default browser and so the guidelines changed to better match Chrome's interpretation.
It's already happened when Microsoft released the first version of Edge. Google killed it by making it "incompatible" with its services.
Cloudflare? By giving money to a project aiming at breaking up the duopoly...?