this post was submitted on 03 Sep 2025
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Work Reform
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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.
Our Philosophies:
- All workers must be paid a living wage for their labor.
- Income inequality is the main cause of lower living standards.
- Workers must join together and fight back for what is rightfully theirs.
- We must not be divided and conquered. Workers gain the most when they focus on unifying issues.
Our Goals
- Higher wages for underpaid workers.
- Better worker representation, including but not limited to unions.
- Better and fewer working hours.
- Stimulating a massive wave of worker organizing in the United States and beyond.
- Organizing and supporting political causes and campaigns that put workers first.
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I was curious how many U.S. households earn at least $170k, and this website responded to asking about 170k by saying that the 80th percentile is $165,068.
So the top 20%, seems a reasonable metric to consider wealthy.
I'd go with 20% as upper class. I think of "wealthy" as having money that lets you come and go as you please, just buy a fancy car if you want without really having to think about the finances of it.
There is a D&D-type game that measures wealth as a rating of 0 to 5, and you can make essentially unlimited purchases of items costing up to 1 below your wealth rating essentially at-will. So someone can buy a sandwich whenever, someone else could take a decent vacation/cruise whenever, another could buy a decent car without worry, one could buy a nice house like it's nothing, and finally someone who could buy a mansion or private jet without real concern. Those in the couple-hundred-million to billions range.
I'd draw the Wealthy line somewhere in the mid-4 range on that scale. You could also consider it as "the point where safe/moderate investments could continue supplying a family plenty of comfort without working for two+ generations".
Don't get me wrong I'd love to be top 20%, but they're still so solidly middle class it's not even funny.
I definitely get that from a reasonable perspective. But then I think about the words being used, and part of me wants terms like "upper" and "middle" to represent portions of a whole that have broadly similar sizes. But that doesn't really reflect the realities of the meaningful differences between two different lives usually meant by the terms, so that part of me needs to take a back seat.
I believe we are arguing over semantics of upper class vs wealthy.
I'm not even sure I would say we are arguing. You provided your version I offered mine. We disagree, maybe, but I don't think either of us is concerned enough to make a concerted effort to change the other's opinion.
Yes, I did just argue over the semantics of argument itself. What of it? This is ~~America~~ the Internet, after all.