I don't understand what it's going to take for someone to do something. Protests are not going to work when they're holding all our money, services, rights, data, etc hostage, and threatening all our public servants. We already had a hard time protesting before this, because health care is tied to employment. It's not a coincidence that they're going after Medicare and Medicaid. They want an entire nation of indentured servants. Unable to own anything, including our own freedom. When we can't work anymore we can just go die in the wilderness like animals I guess. Hmm where have we heard that before?

Everyone is terrified and exhausted. It seems pretty evident that the election was outright stolen, and I have a hard time believing nobody in power suspected something that many of us immediately called, not with the mountains of evidence that's been stacking up for months, years even. So why didn't they do anything? Why did they wait until Trump was sworn in to even talk about it?

I see Canadians online talking about Americans like we chose this. But we didn't, it was forced upon us, and we're begging for help! Who can we turn to if not our allies? What is going on???

Edit: To those claiming that I'm just as bad as the J6ers, that the election was not tampered with and Harris just ran a terrible campaign; whether unwittingly or not, you are part of the problem. You're falling for the suppression and misinformation tactics, or you're facilitating them. I'm editing my comment to compile some links, but let me be clear, I fully expect that you're going to deny these facts as well, and move the goalposts again. My refusal to engage is not a concession, it's me protecting what little emotional energy I have left.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2024_United_States_elections

Some great information about voter suppression from a trusted journalist: https://www.gregpalast.com/trump-lost-vote-suppression-won/

This guy's compilation is great

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/eligible-voters-swept-up-conservative-activists-purge-voter-rolls/

https://www.youtube.com/live/284VFHrO8Nc?si=F-fk-rB6dH2_taWv

https://sos.ga.gov/news/georgias-2024-statewide-risk-limiting-audit-confirms-voting-system-accuracy ~ please note the date (November 20th) and how soon after the election this was, in business days. This link should be taken into consideration with a few more facts, including what we know about their flawed 2020 audit and Trump's famous phone call. Here is a good examination of the audit showing two very important oddities that should be further examined: https://goudanachos.github.io/pages/georgia-rla-discrepancy-analysis-2024/

https://www.newsweek.com/democrats-voting-machines-trump-investigation-2018890

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/fake-bomb-threats-linked-russia-briefly-close-georgia-polling-locations-2024-11-05/

https://english.elpais.com/usa/2025-01-06/musk-and-putins-dual-interference-in-europe.html ~ an article about just some of the countries where there are suspected or substantiated instances of election interference.

Yes, this is what NATO is for. It is an alliance meant to prevent fascism from taking hold. Just because it's only ever been used in non member countries doesn't mean it can't be used on us, especially if Trump continues to threaten allies. Talking about this leading to WWIII is a strawman argument. You don't know that will happen and it is not a good reason to not be asking for help from our allies. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO

To those who think comparisons to Hitler and Nazi Germany are hyperbole:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/01/hitler-germany-constitution-authoritarianism/681233/

I fully expect that some of the bad actors from reddit are here as well. For anyone else reading this: Question their motives. If they're trying to deny what we can see with our own eyes, their intentions are not good.

I will continue to add links as I'm able.

Watch this if you haven't already: https://youtu.be/CVgNJf6CsBA?si=_SBBLf_yuNVuif7y

[–] Vespair@lemm.ee 62 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (6 children)

People keep saying this, but WHO?

Who are you talking about?

Who is this "somebody" you keep talking about showing up to save us?

Look, nobody is coming to save us, and asking somebody else to risk harm on your behalf is selfish.

If we object, it isn't on somebody else to show up and save us, it's on us.

If you aren't willing to make the moves yourself, who the fuck are you to ask somebody else to.

Nobody is coming to save us, folks. It's either us, me and you, or it's nobody.

[–] SPOOSER@lemmy.today 15 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I don't trust anyone enough for something to actually be done. Buy guns, buy 3d Printers, learn to make clothing, prepate your homesteads, prepare for isolation and be ready to lean on and support your neighbors.

Be the best you can be, make good relationships with those around you, and brace yourselves . It's the only thing I can realistically think I alone can do for me, my family, and my community.

Is it a doomer view? I don't think so. I like to have hope that my vote can fix something. I like to think my protests are heard and considered. But at the end of the day I have to focus on doing what I actually can.

[–] Vespair@lemm.ee 12 points 2 weeks ago

I have a similar, albeit slightly less doomer, view currently. Focus on the safety and good of your community and loved ones, and remember that nothing is guaranteed to us. Do the necessary good steps like voting and protesting, but don't be naïve enough to think that's the whole of necessary action or a magic bullet to solve the problems. Do the good, but focus on the real workable action in your direct sphere of influence. Cheers.

[–] Drivebyhaiku@lemmy.world 9 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Isolation really is an American mentality but it's not particularly great for actually striking out. If you want to atop things from getting worse Collectivist activities and thinking is your best chance.

Reach out to the people who are already doing stuff. If you have a union or a political action group, go to it and start organizing. If someone has already started organizing then join them and be subordinate. Find people who understand democratic systems and collective action and offer your time. In fighting is the luxury of peacetime so learn to do that which is not your own exact process. Set aside differences and petty disagreement and work to mutual benefit.

Learn the Roberts rules of order or how your local and state governments function and utilize channels that exist. If you have a gardening or farmers market society reach out and looking at replacing your lawn for gardens and pool with like minded neighbours. Learn first aid and stock a kit. Train your body to be fit and learn self defense. Prepare yourself to be disobedient on someone else's behalf.

Your votes at a federal level are no longer being considered but will your protest be toothless? If you are feeling doom, reach out and find hope in solidarity.

[–] SPOOSER@lemmy.today 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

I agree!!! When I said isolation I meant more in the place where you are, build yourself up so when your neighbors need help they can lean on you for a bit while they set themselves up when things start to collapse.

The answer is not a cabin in the woods, but to make yourself as ready as you can be so you can help others so they can get to a position where they can help you.

EDIT: and support those in your community that ARE prepared so you can help one another.

[–] itslilith@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 2 weeks ago

The cavalry's not coming. It's just us.

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[–] randon31415@lemmy.world 48 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

In 2016, people thought that Trump was the problem. That if Trump left, we could have civility restored to the electoral process. Defeating Trump won't solve the problem because he isn't it - it is the electorate. The voters need to SEE what will happen when this or that occur.

Deport all the immigrants, see the damage that brings, then bring them back with legal protections this time.

Cancel all the science, see how far behind we get, then bring it back with all the funding to make the next moonshot.

Get rid of all fogien aid, watch as our global power dimishes, the vote to bring it back with a clear and true purpose other than empire building.

The people don't know WHY these things are important, and are unwilling to listen or learn. Thus, the only teacher is to experience. But to quote Trump: "There will be some pain" when doing it.

[–] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 37 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

I don't disagree with you and I would love it if people had to experience the consequences of their poor decisions and learn hard lessons that they've been evading for years. The problem is that millions of innocents are and will be caught in the crosshairs. This is a matter of life or death for many people who did not vote for him and it is unconscionable to allow all those people to die just so a bunch of loud racist hillbillies with lead poisoning can learn a lesson.

[–] randon31415@lemmy.world 20 points 2 weeks ago

Fair, I just see no other way of swaying minds without consequences. We tried 4 years of shielding people from Trump's baser urges, and we ended with thousands of people dying each day to COVID. Then 4 year later THEY VOTED HIM BACK IN.

[–] sleepmode@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

They don't even know what DEI means until oh hey, they're out on disability for months+ for surgery in their physically demanding job and need help because their arm or whatever doesn't work and/or they'll be out for surgery for months and/or SSDI rejects their claim. The willful ignorance and just plain ignorance is really sad.

[–] Rekorse@sh.itjust.works 5 points 2 weeks ago

There are already millions caught in the crosshairs. Its not a choice between doing nothing and saving lives, and doing something and losing them. We are losing them both ways but by doing nothing people evade social responsibility.

[–] MY_ANUS_IS_BLEEDING@lemm.ee 21 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

100%. Even after he leaves office, is anyone confident that the country will collectively go "well that was embarrassing, anyway, back to normality now!"

[–] SLVRDRGN@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

How, at this point, could anyone assume that in 4 years Trump will just "leave the office"?

[–] Tehdastehdas@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago

If voting will be fixed as Trump promised, a different puppet could be installed. This would increase the appearance of legitimacy.

[–] sleepmode@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Dead on. This is a snowballing shit storm building since Reagan. Probably earlier. Trump is only a foothold, a useful idiot. He's popular with the Boomers and knows how to work them and use the language. They even refer to him as "their boy." Meanwhile he's "making deals" e.g. pumping the dicks of other corpos like Xi and Putin and pretending to get them on board even when he fails with the smarter leaders while his little weasels dismantle shit in the background.

[–] Flocklesscrow@lemm.ee 5 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

This is spot on.

Just as we saw with Boomers in the UK, who happily threw their country off an economic cliff with Brexit, America's Boomers are equally feckless and unrelenting.

People over the age of 70 should lose the right to vote and just focus on being old and retired. It's absurd to have people constantly voting to chop down the tree whose shade they will never live to enjoy.

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[–] Tehdastehdas@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago

The nonvoters might learn, but not the brainwashed consuming Fox News - they'll blame the left once again.

[–] tetris11@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Will they actually see it though is the question, or will they greedily accept the new set of lies as the world burns around them.

[–] leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 44 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

It wasn't stolen and it wasn't forced on you. Depressingly enough, turkeys, it seems, do sometimes vote for Christmas. I totally agree with you about the awfulness of the situation but - he told you how he was going to govern, he told you what he was going to do and then he won the election that enables him to do it. You did, as a nation, choose this.

I don't know how any nation state can really intervene on that basis. Its not like Hitler steam rolling Poland or Putin annexing the Crimea - this isn't an invasion or a hostile takeover, it's an elected President carrying out the will of the people that voted for him.

[–] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 26 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

I'm not going to argue with you, I get enough of that on reddit. But there is a literal mountain of evidence, including their own statements and sketchy behavior, hard data, unsecured voting machines, various voter suppression tactics, ballots that were tossed, code that was published online months (possibly more than a year) before the election, and one of the twerps currently taking over the treasury wrote code that can falsify ballots while he was an intern for Musk.

Also, it is like Hitler, they're using the same exact playbook, and while there are some key differences there is no arguing that this is the exact reason NATO exists. Justin Trudeau could invoke article 4 for threats of invasion. Someone from our government should still be able to invoke article 5. These international agreements exist because when the highest power in the nation is compromised, we need outside help.

[–] sdfric88@lemmy.sdf.org 16 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I'm sorry, I'm Canadian, and what exactly do you think all of NATO could do, allied and organized against the American armed forces? Do you seriously believe we could stage an effective military campaign against America? That would he suicide.

[–] wide_eyed_stupid@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

It's just so fucked up, all of it. They've been pumping shitloads of money into their military for so long, it's a behemoth larger than the military of the next, what, 9 countries combined? All that money should have been spent on things that are actually good for U.S. citizens. A better educational system, a healthcare system, more worker protections, a better social security net, trying to fix homelessness, etc.

But now, their humongous military is going to be used against their own people and their allies. And all the while I'm here thinking that a well-educated, healthy, happy populace would have been much less inclined to vote a fascist into office. But hey, they didn't need all that, they were already the best country in the world, right?

[–] drthunder@midwest.social 7 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

The worst part is that we're rich enough as a country to have our obscene military spending and civilized healthcare and education, we just choose not to.

[–] gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de 7 points 2 weeks ago

yeah but if you give out civilized healthcare, how will you bully your people into working hard so they don't end up in the trench abandoned?

[–] InputZero@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Using NATO to stop Trump, you want WW3? Because that's how you get WW3. You're not going to get any help until you help yourselfs. It's your house, you have to clean it up. If you need an idea of a place to start, I'd start with the Democrats.

If you have democratic senators you should be a thorn in their side about why aren't they grinding the Senate to a halt. Why they aren't using every tool available to resist senate Republicans. The Republicans did when Obama was president and he wasn't a fascist. Now seems like a good time to start using all those republican cheats to blanket obstruct the Senate and Congress.

If you have republican senators you should be getting involved with the democratic party, first screaming and dragging everyone you know with you. Then demanding over and over that the old game is dead and they need you and the people to get out of this.

Regardless, no one is coming to save you. You need to first believe that you can actually work with your neighbors, then saves yourselves. Tons of Americans have been begging for your help to stop Trump for over a decade now and you thought it was just their job to take care of it. Well guess what, it was yours too and you failed to answer the call.

[–] leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

This is literally the first I've heard of any of these things and whilst I'm not in North America I follow the political situation pretty closely. I'm not saying your wrong about any of it but who are the people saying this and where are they saying it? Has it been reported on either internally or externally to the US?

The overall playbook is fascist I agree but the situation I was trying to compare was Hitler invading a sovereign nation. Trump hasn't done that (yet anyway). I've got good friends in the US and I am very worried about them, I'm just not sure you're betting on the right horse by asking for outside nation-state aid. Rightly or wrongly they'll see that Trump was elected legally and they're never going to invade a country on that basis. There was zero talk of repercussions for Germany until Hitler invaded Poland because he followed the democratic process (or successfully manipulated it) to get elected and assume total power.

[–] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

With all due respect, if this is the first you're hearing of any of this, then no you are not following the situation "pretty closely."

The hundreds of bomb threats from Russian servers on election day alone should be enough to convince people that some hinky shit was going on.

There's all kinds of stuff on Bluesky, discussion on reddit and lemmy, lots of reliable sources like AP News, The Atlantic, and Gizmodo, as well as recordings of interviews with Musk, and of Trump rallies. There's also hard ballot data from at least a few counties that has been studied by highly qualified analysts, and matches trends we see in elections in other countries that we know were a sham.

I could keep going but I'm tired and it's just not worth it. You're obviously skeptical, and that's just human nature, but how am I supposed to convince a skeptic from another country who isn't witnessing or experiencing this first hand? I'm not going to spin my wheels tracking down evidence for you, it's not a good use of the limited energy I have left. If you're truly curious the information is out there.

[–] leraje@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 weeks ago (4 children)

I'm not skeptical at all - I'm simply unaware of what you're talking about. When I say I'm following the situation pretty closely I mean the political situation as reported in the mainstream press. I don't think anyone who's from a country not directly involved is going to be aware of every resource unless its a special interest of theirs or its their job. I wouldn't expect someone not from the UK to be up to date with the latst developments of the Reform Party and how they're trying to swing the narrative here. If you have links, link 'em, I will definitely read them all. I'm asking you to lift my ignorance on the subject.

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[–] Tm12@lemmy.ca 18 points 2 weeks ago (7 children)

I don't understand what it's going to take for someone to do something

Who is someone? Who is something? Organize and mobilize. I know all Americans didn’t choose this, but you’ll need a lot of support/like minded folks (which it sounds like you have). Trump’s shock doctrine has clearly worked. Try and focus on tangible steps to take whether it’s annoying the heck out of your elected officials, joining a grassroots org, or attending a public rally on an off day.

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[–] tonbo@lemmy.world 16 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

What are you asking outside forces to do? Invade America and install a foreign government because americans are unable to maintain their freedom?

[–] Tankton@lemm.ee 13 points 2 weeks ago

Perhaps we can ask the Taliban for help

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[–] Limonene@lemmy.world 14 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

To those claiming ... that the election was not tampered with

I will agree that there was targeted voter suppression, targeted registration purges, and Russian propaganda. But all of this has been around for many elections. It's wrong that we have to live with this in the US, but it's already been challenged in court, largely unsuccessfully. So we do have to live with it, until it can be fixed by a legislature that actually works for the people.

Even if you could prove voting machine tampering sufficient to change the election, there's still the problem that 77 million voters chose catastrophe. You can't possibly prove that this was off by an order of magnitude. We have to face the reality that there is an excess of bad voters, and a shortage of good candidates.

[–] Ultraviolet@lemmy.world 12 points 2 weeks ago

Every suppressed vote is as fraudulent as any fake vote.

[–] PetteriSkaffari@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

In a democracy, however flawed it may be, politics are still the result of a large part of the population's will. Which is strongly influenced by propaganda of course, and without much thought of all the consequences that it may have, but still. Protest against these politics can come in many forms, depending on how strongly people are affected by it, never mind how exhausted people think they might be.

Then there's also the military, does anybody here have any insight how they feel about the recent political changes that have been carried through?

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[–] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 12 points 2 weeks ago (5 children)

It seems pretty evident that the election was outright stolen, and I have a hard time believing nobody in power suspected something that many of us immediately called, not with the mountains of evidence that’s been stacking up for months, years even. So why didn’t they do anything? Why did they wait until Trump was sworn in to even talk about it?

No, dems just did a piss-poor job of motivating people. I voted for her, but she wasn't offering much other than an alternative to him. Same as ever.

Repubs motivate their people with lies and slander, but it's still motivational for hate-mongers. Don't sound like they did when Biden won. It wasn't stolen. Dems failed us.

[–] bitjunkie@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago

It can be both. Pissweak corpodems don't inspire enough people for a landslide, and landslides are much harder to rig.

[–] Crikeste@lemm.ee 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

This is the most frustrating thing about this administration: They are showing that you CAN do things. Democrats sit on their asses for four years, and Trump did all this in less than a month. Democrats better get their steel toe fucking boots on and kick these conservatives fucks in the sick.

ANYTHING LESS AND I SAY FUCK YOU

I am fucking sick of trying to do the right thing and GETTING FUCKING NOTHING.

Sorry, got a little pissed there lol

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[–] sleepmode@lemmy.world 9 points 2 weeks ago

The Canadians I talk to are either furiously pissed off and lashing out at me like I'm about to annex them myself or dead ass silent. This is a weird fucking timeline to say the least.

[–] StarshotJohn@lemmy.world 9 points 2 weeks ago (8 children)

Thanks for this. Anytime I talk about these things to folks outside the US, it's always some reply about "your country chose this!" And how, regardless of how I voted, I still somehow let this happen. It's super frustrating and disheartening. Now, it is the cool thing to be super anti-American. This country has a huge population of people who are terrified and strictly opposed to what is happening. Once you decide: "Fuck the US," you're turning your back on millions of Americans that did not want this to happen and did what they could do stop it. We need help in our resistance. Please don't abandon us.

[–] ramjambamalam@lemmy.ca 10 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I hear you. Americans in general aren't our (Canada's) enemy, but your President is, along with those who voted for him (and to a lesser extent, those who did not vote), and I have much less sympathy for the "leopards ate my face" crowd during Trump's second term than his first, since he made it very well known what kind of charlatan he was.

[–] teamevil@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago

That president is the enemy of every single American worth less than a billion dollars, unfortunately there's a solid chunk of Americans who seem to think they're going to wake up and become billionaires. But please know we don't want any of this stupid bullshit

[–] PagingDoctorLove@lemmy.world 10 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

I hear you, friend. Just remember, they don't live here. They haven't experienced the calculated dismantling of our education system. They haven't seen the meteoric rise of Christian nationalism. They don't know how sick and tired the general population is. Social safety nets are more robust in their countries, so they don't have nearly the same number of racist, angry, lead addled boomers managing to gain a chokehold on every aspect of our daily lives.

But we do live here, we have experienced it, and you are not alone.

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[–] WagyuSneakers@lemm.ee 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Non Americans don't understand and assume we have the same liberties as them.

"Just do die in the street and achieve nothing" Isn't the compelling moral argument many Canadians seem to think it is.

[–] CarbonBasedNPU@lemm.ee 5 points 2 weeks ago

Either go protest and get shot or you clearly asked for your rights to be stripped away feels like a slap in the face for anyone who is directly affected by the things that is happening and is extremely demotivating. It feels like someone saying that somehow it was your individual fault that states that you are not in did not vote the way you would have liked them too.

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[–] gearheart@lemm.ee 8 points 2 weeks ago

I hear you... The problem is no one is going to come save us.

Change can only happen internally.

Unsure what can be done though... Voting and protests don't seem to be effective...

If nothing changes everyone will have to get comfortable enough to feel like freedom is fighting for.

This means first amendment up, train, and be ready for the day to when we need to defend our constitution.

The confederacy already lost once, they will lose again.

At the rate this is going I honestly don't see any other future.

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