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this post was submitted on 26 Dec 2024
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wdym not result of SAM
It clearly fell from a window
Late response because I'm on vacation:
I was wrong. Thanks for your post. Vile Putin.
Those are definitely caused by birds /s.
clearly suicide
mutant chickens from girkin's biolab
Those are not the markings that a Surface-to-Air-Missile leaves on a plane. I'd reckon those look more like bullet holes
ETA: I know less than I thought. My bad
Surface to air missiles use various forms of shrapnel depending on the missile, this is basically 100% a SAM. This also looks very similar to the damage from the other airliner Russia shot down a few years ago with one of their mobile Sam units.
https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/azerbaijan-airlines-flight-was-downed-by-russian-air-defence-system-four-sources-2024-12-26/
Tbf it looks like FLAK more than anything else.
What's the Russian equivalent of the Gepard?
FlAK stands for FlugAbwehrKanone, meaning air defence cannon. What you mean is shrapnel, which air defence missiles use to shoot down planes.
The Gepard is a SHORAD system using airburst autocannons to hit stuff, but airliners usually fly too high for that. The Russian equivalents from newest to older systems are the Pantsir, the Tunguska and the Shilka, IDK if they still use Shilkas though.
plane was hit at about 3km, so within range of even MANPADS and pantsir guns, but it was a bit misty so IR and photocontrast guidance is out. azeris suspect command guided pantsir missile, that is 57e6 or similar, which has some 7x less explosive than buk missile used in mh17 shootdown
shilkas are still good against drones so i suspect they do use them. ukrainians use everything down to 12.7mm and 7.62mm machine guns for this purpose
Gerpard does not use airburst, it needs to directly hit. The rounds have a timed fuse to avoid hitting the ground, so they explose after some seconds.
wait doesn't gepard use AHEAD, what was all that fuss with swiss refusing reexport of that special ammo
Schrapnell like the ones of FlaK-Explosivgeschosse you say?
they don't have anything like that, if you mean programmable airburst ammunition
Hm, yeah, that's ehat I meant.
But surely a SAM wouldn't have gone unnoticed?
i think that crash gave plenty of notice
I think you know what I meant
pilot thought it was bird strike and that's why it was reported as such initially
not sure if pilots discussed it with kazakh or only russian ground control, so take it with a grain of salt
Looks more like guns than a missile, but what do I know.
irregular, non-circular holes make me think fragments more than anything else
What sort of gun produces so many holes of so varying sizes, let alone that accurately? Or do you mean they randomly unloaded once or was on the ground?
Same kind of damage as on MH17 which was a BUK missile if I remember correctly. It basically explodes near the target like a big handgrenade causing scattered damage like this.
Could be flak explosion.