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113

Under-16s to be banned from buying high-caffeine energy drinks including Monster (inews.co.uk)

submitted 1 week ago by thehatfox@lemmy.world to c/unitedkingdom@feddit.uk

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[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 34 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

I thought they were already banned for under 16s won't they?

[–] EdanGrey@sh.itjust.works 22 points 1 week ago (1 children)

No there is a voluntary thing where shops can choose not to sell to under 16s. Many of the supermarkets do this.

[+] Highlandcow@feddit.uk -9 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Jeez, man this sucks, why shouldn't a teenager be able to make these decisions for himself, they aren't stupid

[–] SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world 19 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

They're not stupid, but their brains aren't fully developed yet. A huge problem is the fact that the part of the brain that takes into consideration possible consequences for any action one decides to take is one of the last things to fully develop, and that doesn't happen until roughly age 25. That's why so many college-age kids do some pretty stupid things at parties and such.

[–] tal@lemmy.today 5 points 1 week ago (1 children)

https://perkcoffee.co/sg/countries-consume-coffee/

The UK appears to be nowhere near the top of countries on per-capita coffee consumption, at less than a third Finland's rate.

However, it does appear to be very high on prevalence of cocaine consumption:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_prevalence_of_cocaine_use

[–] BeardedGingerWonder@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

We rather famously drink tea.

[–] tal@lemmy.today 1 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Hmm. That's a good point. I wonder if there's trouble lurking there.

The government proposals will make it illegal to sell high-caffeine energy drinks containing more than 150mg of caffeine per litre to anyone under 16 in England.

Aight, so that's their red line.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/how-much-caffeine-in-coffee

A 12-ounce (oz) cup of brewed coffee may contain 113 to 247 milligrams (mg)Trusted Source of caffeine, whereas a smaller 8-ounce cup can contain about 95 to 200 mg.

Hmm. A liter is 2.8 times larger than a 12 fluid ounce cup, so that'd be 318 mg/L to 696 mg/L.

goes looking for tea

https://angelinos.com/blogs/news/which-tea-is-the-most-caffeinated

#1 Black tea: Between 64 and 112 mg of caffeine per 8-fl oz serving

4.23 of those in a liter, so between 270 mg/L and 473 mg/L.

It looks like tea and coffee

at least were they energy drinks

would have too much caffine.

[–] CallMeAnAI@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Peak Reddit/Lemmy

The infantilism is so high. Teenagers just can't be trusted with a dangerous drug like caffeine!

God you people suck. Annoying everyone into fascism.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Kind of agree, I dont care if they're brain is fully developed or not, caffeine is a legal drug and a teens brain is developed enough to make a decision like this

[–] SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world 0 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

You're obviously affected by this personally, and thus biased. You're blatantly ignoring the fact that few teens have a full understanding of how the human brain works, the chemical interactions involved, or the long-term effects that are possible.

Cigarettes were once actually endorsed by doctors, but we all know better now. I'm not saying this is anywhere near that bad, but that's because I'm admittedly not anywhere near an expert on this - I know the limitations of my knowledge, and when to defer to someone with more expertise. I would suggest you find the humility to do the same.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

"your obviously affected by this" where is your evidence for that? I don't drink caffeine, I don't like coffee and I don't really like tea too much either and ive only have had an energy drink like once, my bias is that I care about personal freedom

Also are you sure teens don't care about how energy drinks affect there brain and dont do research into this stuff? And if so isn't this an issue of education, shouldn't we just make PSAs and include learning about this into personal health development style classes in schools, why is the immediate reaction to jump to curtailing teenagers freedoms and assume they are too stupid to understand, didn't we just give 16 year olds the right to vote, and these kids can already drink alcohol from a young age with parental permission

But your right in that it's fair that we are always learning about how drugs such as nicotine in cigarettes affect us and that things change and we never have the full facts, but this energy drink restriction doesn't seem to be a restriction in most other countries and the main justification seems to be reducing NHS waiting times, I don't think the idea of reducing freedom is the answer to saving the NHS the NHS needs much more complex reform to stay as amazing as it can be

[–] SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world 1 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

"This sucks" were your words - why else would you say that? Your "personal freedom" argument doesn't hold water if you're fine with restrictions on other drugs.

The article says they're restricting under 16s, so I'm not sure what you're thinking with the end of your second paragraph - which kinda lens credence to my point that teens aren't known for thinking things through.

Everyone is different, and that includes how they grow and mature. We all know worry-warts, and we all know boisterous jocks who are more likely not to be careful. Of course some will think about it due to who they are, but many others won't - or erroneously rank other things as more important considerations.

I don't disagree the justification is flimsy, and as an American I'm not sure why they're doing that - but I don't think it's an entirely misguided approach, either.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 1 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Fully developed enough no, but developed enough to handle a legal drug such as caffeine and to look at the back of a bottle and make a decision on what they do not want to put into there bodies, the stupidity of select individual isn't a valid justification of the curtailing of freedom

[–] SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

So let's sell cigarettes to kids, too. They're a legal drug, right?

Look, I'm no expert, and I'm not saying caffeine is as bad as cigarettes, but I'm sure neither of us has a full understanding of the brain, or caffeine's effects upon it. How about admitting you might not know enough to make an informed decision, and let those who do know more work it out?

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Ok fair, I can admit looking at your comment my argument was flawed, I still think though that people of all ages should be able drink whatever caffeine based drink they want as long as it isn't strong enough to kill you which energy drinks arnt, most countries do not have this restriction to my knowledge and I think this use of "public health" and the idea we need to curtail people's freedoms to save NHS money is wrong and that there are more important mismanagement of government funds that needs to be looked at

[–] SanctimoniousApe@lemmings.world 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

It's not unimportant:

Teenager dies in classroom of caffeine overdose after downing latte, energy drink and Mountain Dew
Lethal Lemonade: Energy Drinks Aimed at Young People Linked to Deaths, Cardiac Risks, Lawsuits Allege
This article talks about even relatively young mature adults dying both in the main story as well as in links to some others further down the article.

Yes, these people overdosed, but teens aren't exactly known for their self-control or lack of impulsiveness, so they may do similarly - especially given how so many tend to act like they're almost indestructible thanks to their youth-driven ability to heal more quickly.

There's nothing keeping kids from drinking multiple caffeine drinks as detailed in the links above, so at least ensuring that the drinks are low in caffeine will hopefully slow the intake enough to minimize the risk.

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org -1 points 1 week ago

A huge problem is the fact that the part of the brain that takes into consideration possible consequences for any action one decides to take is one of the last things to fully develop, and that doesn't happen until roughly age 25.

Deff missed this memo.

Although it do get better with age, I guess.

[–] subignition@fedia.io 2 points 1 week ago

sometimes they are... sometimes they are. https://www.epicresearch.org/articles/caffeine-related-ed-visits-although-uncommon-doubled-for-middle-school-and-high-school-aged-children-since-2017

[–] abbiistabbii@lemmy.blahaj.zone 19 points 1 week ago (1 children)

So they are banned from drinking monster, a non alcoholic drink that keeps them awake at a moment of their lives where they a) need to sleep more and b) are made to wake up earlier to go to a place they need to concentrate to get his jobs.

I also guarantee they can go to their local Costa and get a coffee with more shots than a cop in Alabama fires after asking a black guy for their driver's licence.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 8 points 1 week ago

And from a young age can drink alcohol with parental permission lol

[–] unknown@piefed.social 11 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Teenagers with adhd are going to suffer if they can't self medicate with an easily accessible and relatively safe substance like caffeine.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Via the NHS they'd be able to get methylphenidate or a number other drugs to help treat ADHD alot of these drugs work as stimulates that work for long periods of time making them much more effective then energy drinks regarding convenience

But I still get your concern as waiting lists are quite long In this country but there are other forms of caffeine as well that are alot more healthy, I still think this ban is awful though but it's not the end of the world for people with ADHD I luckily don't think

[–] unknown@piefed.social 6 points 1 week ago

Lmao, yeah no it's really not as simple as that.

Do you have any idea how long waiting lists are for adhd and autism assessments? Or how likely adhd is to be overlooked and treated as a personal failing in POC and girls/women?

[–] Denjin@feddit.uk 9 points 1 week ago

Oh no! My horse has bolted! Quick, shut the barn door!

[–] SoftestSapphic@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

This will surely fix a real problem that isn't already easily fixed by wealth redistribution

[–] viking@infosec.pub -2 points 1 week ago

...explain please?