The original post is from r/Romania, but I thought it would be interesting to share this here too.
Bing's Copilot and DuckDuckGos ChatGPT are the same way with Israel's genocide.
this post was submitted on 28 Jan 2025
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I thought that guardrails were implemented just through the initial prompt that would say something like "You are an AI assistant blah blah don't say any of these things..." but by the sounds of it, DeepSeek has the guardrails literally trained into the net?
This must be the result of the reinforcement learning that they do. I haven't read the paper yet, but I bet this extra reinforcement learning step was initially conceived to add these kind of censorship guardrails rather than making it "more inclined to use chain of thought" which is the way they've advertised it (at least in the articles I've read).
Most commercial models have that, sadly. At training time they're presented with both positive and negative responses to prompts.
If you have access to the trained model weights and biases, it's possible to undo through a method called abliteration (1)
The silver lining is that a it makes explicit what different societies want to censor.
Hi I noticed you added a footnote. Did you know that footnotes are actually able to be used like this?[^1]
[^1]: Here's my footnote
Code for it looks like this :able to be used like this?[^1]
[^1]: Here's my footnote
Do you mean that the app should render them in a special way? My Voyager isn't doing anything.
I actually mostly interact with Lemmy via a web interface on the desktop, so I'm unfamiliar with how much support for the more obscure tagging options there is in each app.
It's rendered in a special way on the web, at least.
That's just markdown syntax I think. Clients vary a lot in which markdown they support though.
markdown syntax
yeah I always forget the actual name of it I just memorized some of them early on in using Lemmy.
Although censorship is obviously bad, I'm kinda intrigued by the way it's yapping against itself. Trying to weigh the very important goal of providing useful information against its "programming" telling it not to upset Winnie the Pooh. It's like a person mumbling "oh god oh fuck what do I do" to themselves when faced with a complex situation.
I know right, while reading it I kept thinking "I can totally see how people might start to believe these models are sentient", it was fascinating, the way it was "thinking"
It reminds me one of Asimov's robots trying to reason a way around the Three Laws.
"That Thou Art Mindful of Him" is the robot story of Asimov's that scared me the most, because of this exact reasoning happening. I remember closing the book, staring into space and thinking 'shit....we are all gonna die'
Knowing how it works is so much better than guessing around OpenAI's censoring-out-the-censorship approach. I wonder if these kind of things can be teased out, enumerated, and then run as a specialization pass to nullify.
I don’t have the heart to deal with ai since it’s a huge drain on resources but has anyone asked the American ai purveyors about what happened at Kent state? Or the move firebombings?
This is unsurprising. A Chinese model will be filled with censorship.
Replace Tienanmen with discussions of Palestine, and you get the same censorship in US models.
Our governments aren't as different as they would like to pretend. The media in both countries is controlled by a government-integrated media oligarchy. The US is just a little more gentle with its censorship. China will lock you up for expressing certain views online. The US makes sure all prominent social media sites will either ban you or severely throttle the spread of your posts if you post any political wrongthink.
The US is ultimately just better at hiding its censorship.
Are you seriously drawing equivalencies between being imprisoned by the government and getting banned from Twitter by a non-government organization? That's a whole hell of a lot more than "a little more gentle."
If the USA is trying to do what China does with regards to censorship, they really suck at it. Past atrocities by the United States government, and current atrocities by current United States allies are well known to United States citizens. US citizens talk about these things, join organizations actively decrying these things, publicly protest against these things, and claim to vote based on what politicians have to say about these things, all with full confidence that they aren't going to be disappeared (and that if they do somehow get banned from a website for any of this, making a new account is really easy and their real world lives will be unaffected).
Trying to pass these situations off as similar is ludicrous.
So, how about that... are they not similar now?
It's a bit biased
Nah, just being "helpful and harmless"... when "harm" = "anything against the CCP".
I don't understand how we have such an obsession with Tiananmen square but no one talks about the Athens Polytech massacre where Greek tanks crushed 40 college students to death. The Chinese tanks stopped for the man in the photo! So we just ignore the atrocities of other capitalist nations and hyperfixate on the failings of any country that tries to move away from capitalism???
I think the argument here is that ChatGPT will tell you about Kent State, Athens Polytech, and Tianenmen square. Deepseek won't report on Tianenmen, but it likely reports on Kent State and Athens Polytech (I have no evidence). If a Greek AI refused to talk about the Athens Polytech incident, it would also raise concerns, no?
ChatGPT hesitates to talk about the Palestinian situation, so we still criticize ChatGPT for pandering to American imperialism.
The Chinese tanks stopped for the man in the photo!
What a line dude.
The military shot at the crowd and ran over people in the square the day before. Hundreds died. Stopping for this guy doesn't mean much.
Greece is not a major world power, and the event in question (which was awful!) happened in 1974 under a government which is no longer in power. Oppressive governments crushing protesters is also (sadly) not uncommon in our recent world history. There are many other examples out there for you to dig up.
Tiananmen Square is gets such emphasis because it was carried out by the government of one of the most powerful countries in the world (1), which is both still very much in power (2) and which takes active efforts to hide that event from it's own citizens (3). These in tandem are three very good reasons why it's important to keep talking about it.
Hmm. Well, all I can say is that the US has commited countless atrocities against other nations and even our own citizens. Last I checked, China didn't infect their ethnic minorities with Syphilis and force the doctors not to treat it under a threat of death, but the US government did that to black Americans.
You have no idea if China did that. If they had, they would have taken great efforts to cover it up, and could very well have succeeded. It's a small wonder we know any of the terrible things they did, such as the genocide they are actively engaging in right now.