308
Anti-Zionism is not antisemitic.
Lumping in all Jewish people with the genocidal apartheid ethnostate absolutely is.
this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2023
308 points (94.3% liked)
politics
19120 readers
2549 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Holy shit that's poignant
Hey Congress, the Israeli Government sucks and not all Palestinians are bad people.
"The resolution suggests that all anti-Zionism -- it states -- is antisemitism. That’s either intellectually disingenuous or just factually wrong," said New York Representative Jerry Nadler, who voted present.
...and who also happens to be Jewish.
And that's the what; here's the why:
AIPAC Throws Millions at Possible Insurgent Campaigns to Unseat Progressive Democrats
In a mounting offensive by AIPAC, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, to unseat progressives who speak up for Palestinian rights, Westchester County Executive George Latimer, who has been courted by AIPAC, announced earlier today he is launching a primary challenge against New York Congressmember Jamaal Bowman.
to Unseat Progressive Democrats
No wonder so much of the party voted for this.
load more comments
(2 replies)
This is ridiculous, the first anti zionists were all Jewish. Some were even assassinated for their views. Zionism should not be conflated with Jewishness at all.
Unfortunately, that's too nuanced a presentation of facts for most people to digest. No one actually knows anything about history anymore.
I am so tired of this bullshit and of Isreal's bullshit. I don't care if people think I am antisemitic because technically I am. I am in the same way I'm anti Christian, Muslim, Buddhism, Odinism and every other religion. Can we please stop using superstition as a reason to kill and hate eachother when there are plenty of good reasons to already do that or better yet just stop doing it all together.
Then you're anti-judaism, not antisemitic
Religion isnt the reason, it's just the excuse.
The reason is money and power. It always has been.
I think the best term is "anti theocracy" and while Israel is in theory a democracy they are first and foremost a theocracy because the democracy is a right only reserved for those inside the theocratic construct.
No they are a secular democracy. Their laws are not based on Judaism. Judaism prohibits most things they do.
Israelis hate black black Jews as well. It's just a racist white ethno-state.
If they are an apartheid state with tiers of citizens, they aren't a democracy.
load more comments
(1 replies)
- Alma Adams (NC)
- Colin Allred (TX)
- Gabe Amo (RI)
- Jake Auchincloss (MA)
- Ami Bera (CA)
- Sanford D. Bishop Jr. (GA)
- Lisa Blunt Rochester (DE)
- Julia Brownley (CA)
- Nikki Budzinski (IL)
- Yadira Caraveo (CO)
- Salud Carbajal (CA)
- Matt Cartwright (PA)
- Kathy Castor (FL)
- Sheila Cherfilus-McCormick (FL)
- Steve Cohen (TN)
- Jim Costa (CA)
- Joe Courtney (CT)
- Angie Craig (MN)
- Jason Crow (CO)
- Henry Cuellar (TX)
- Don Davis (NC)
- Rosa DeLauro (CT)
- Chris Deluzio (PA)
- Anna Eshoo (CA)
- Lizzie Fletcher (TX)
- Lois Frankel (FL)
- Maxwell Frost (FL)
- Ruben Gallego (AZ)
- Jared Golden (ME)
- Vicente Gonzalez (TX)
- Josh Gottheimer (NJ)
- Josh Harder (CA)
- Jahana Hayes (CT)
- Brian Higgins (NY)
- Jim Himes (CT)
- Steven Horsford (NV)
- Steny Hoyer (MD)
- Jared Huffman (CA)
- Jeff Jackson (NC)
- William Keating (MA)
- Derek Kilmer (WA)
- Ann Kuster (NH)
- Greg Landsman (OH)
- John Larson (CT)
- Susie Lee (NV)
- Mike Levin (CA)
- Stephen Lynch (MA)
- Kathy Manning (NC)
- Doris Matsui (CA)
- Kweisi Mfume (MD)
- Joe Morelle (NY)
- Jared Moskowitz (FL)
- Seth Moulton (MA)
- Frank J. Mrvan (IN)
- Richard Neal (MA)
- Joe Neguse (CO)
- Wiley Nickel (NC)
- Donald Norcross (NJ)
- Frank Pallone Jr. (NJ)
- Jimmy Panetta (CA)
- Chris Pappas (NH)
- Bill Pascrell Jr. (NJ)
- Mary Peltola (AK)
- Marie Gluesenkamp Pérez (WA)
- Scott Peters (CA)
- Brittany Pettersen (CO)
- Mike Quigley (IL)
- C.A. Dutch Ruppersberger (MD)
- Adam Schiff (CA)
- Brad Schneider (IL)
- Hillary Scholten (MI)
- Kim Schrier (WA)
- David Scott (GA)
- Terri Sewell (AL)
- Brad Sherman (CA)
- Elissa Slotkin (MI)
- Adam Smith (WA)
- Eric Sorensen (IL)
- Darren Soto (FL)
- Abigail Spanberger (VA)
- Melanie Stansbury (NM)
- Greg Stanton (AZ)
- Haley Stevens (MI)
- Eric Swalwell (CA)
- Emilia Sykes (OH)
- Shri Thanedar (MI)
- Mike Thompson (CA)
- Dina Titus (NV)
- Norma Torres (CA)
- Ritchie Torres (NY)
- David Trone (MD)
- Juan Vargas (CA)
- Marc Veasey (TX)
- Debbie Wasserman Schultz (FL)
- Frederica Wilson (FL)
Well fuck. My reps on there. Shot them a note asking why.
Let us know whether they call you an anti Semite directly or just kinda dance around it.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(2 replies)
The problem with this sort of language is that there are a few different things that people call "anti-Zionism". One is saying Israel does not have a holy right to the entirety of the land of Israel. Another is saying Israel has no right to exist at all. A third is any criticism of Israel or the Israeli leadership.
Only the second is antisemitism, as it implies that Jewish people and their nation should not exist.
Trouble is, it all gets lumped together. Any criticism of the Israeli leadership is fodder for the anti-semites who would wipe out the Jewish people given the opportunity. Any defense of the nation of Israel or the Jewish people is taken as tacit endorsement of the atrocities they are commiting.
This is an unsustainable level of intransigence that leaves no path forward resolving in peace.
No.
Saying the state of Israel has no right to exist is not antisemitic either.
You're continuing the deliberate mistake of conflating Israel (a political entity) with Judaism (a religion). Not every Israeli is Jewish, nor is every Jew Israeli. Likewise Israel is not Jewish peoples nation, Jewish people live all over the world and call many nations their home.
Also why do you believe people should have an ethno-state of their own?
load more comments
(27 replies)
Only the second is antisemitism
No. No theocracy or ethno state has a right to exist. Brutal apartheid is baked into these concepts. For some reason most of the world can get on board when it comes to oppressive governments like Iran or even China spreading Han culture. If the myth of "a people without a land to a land without a people" were true there might be a case, but there is no such land, and certainly not in Palestine.
as it implies that Jewish people and their nation should not exist.
This is wildly incorrect. The only inherent implication of saying the state of Israel has no right to exist is that the state of Israel has no right to exist. That is, a state foundationally for and only for a certain ethno-religion, forcibly and violently founded in a land already full of people who aren't a part of that ethno-religion. Such a state is oppressive by its nature, given that the majority of people within its borders of control (and especially people within those borders and displaced from within those borders) are disenfranchised and do not have equal rights under the law or under the enforcement of law.
Another is saying Israel has no right to exist at all.
Only the second is antisemitism, as it implies that Jewish people and their nation should not exist.
Completely disagree. It's a nation like any other. It has as much right to exist as the USA or Constantinople.
I'm not entirely on board with the idea of nations having rights at all. The people living in them do, but I don't see how an abstract entity should have rights that the people it represents don't have on their own.
To give a concrete example: the people of Iraq have a right to exist. But it's a country composed of ethnic groups that don't especially like each other, so having them all live in a single country isn't necessarily great. I don't think Iraq has a right to be a country, especially if it's interfering with the right to self-determination of the people living there. Maybe as a practical matter it's better for the country to exist, but rights aren't supposed to be contingent on practical concerns.
load more comments
(1 replies)
load more comments
(21 replies)
load more comments
(1 replies)
Congress having a normal one
Just 14 lawmakers voted against the resolution
No wonder it passed
The zionist argument that "anti-zionism is anti-semitism" is a fascist lie. Anyone who spreads this lie is a puppet of Likud.
Zionists have been trying to do this forever.
They don't argue in good faith.
view more: next ›