this post was submitted on 31 Dec 2023
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[–] Grimy@lemmy.world 22 points 10 months ago (2 children)

My view of it is that if it doesn't go fast, we end up in a boiled frog situation where every year a few more jobs are lost but not enough for people to protest and the rich end up owning all of us like slaves after a couple of decades.

If in the space of a few years we lose virtually all jobs, it will be hard to argue against the obvious solutions like rapid nationalization of assets and fully automated communism.

[–] ramblinguy@sh.itjust.works 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

A frog that is slowly boiled will jump out. However, if it's dropped in boiling water, it'll die because it doesn't have time to jump out before the proteins in its body get destroyed. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling_frog

Relevant because I don't think slow change is as irreversible as fast change, and might actually be more manageable

[–] wikibot@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

Here's the summary for the wikipedia article you mentioned in your comment:

The boiling frog is an apologue describing a frog being slowly boiled alive. The premise is that if a frog is put suddenly into boiling water, it will jump out, but if the frog is put in tepid water which is then brought to a boil slowly, it will not perceive the danger and will be cooked to death. The story is often used as a metaphor for the inability or unwillingness of people to react to or be aware of sinister threats that arise gradually rather than suddenly. While some 19th-century experiments suggested that the underlying premise is true if the heating is sufficiently gradual, according to modern biologists the premise is false: changing location is a natural thermoregulation strategy for frogs and other ectotherms, and is necessary for survival in the wild. A frog that is gradually heated will jump out. Furthermore, a frog placed into already boiling water will die immediately, not jump out.

^article^ ^|^ ^about^

[–] tabarnaski@sh.itjust.works 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

While I agree with your first paragraph, I'm not sure that communism would be a solution, given how history has shown us that it can be quite easily corrupted and used by the elite to exploit the masses.

A capitalist system where political power have the means to control financial power, and where there are limits to the influence of money in politics, might be better IMHO.

[–] spacecowboy@sh.itjust.works 10 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Can you honestly look at the state of society (and the planet, in a more literal sense) and say that capitalism is doing a good job…? It’s rampant with corruption and suffering.

[–] tabarnaski@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's doing a not so bad job in a few countries (spoiler: the US is not among them), e.g. Finland, Denmark, Germany, Canada. I'm not saying it's a perfect system, not even a good system, just that it's a good place to start.

Wealth redistribution requires that there's wealth to begin with, and capitalism is clearly the system with the best incentives to create wealth. You just need strong policies to prevent sociopaths a la Musk, Thiel or Bezos to try to hoard "all the money", to easily break up monopolies, etc.

[–] spacecowboy@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago

Canada is not doing okay, its government is clearly corrupt and has no problem letting the population flounder in a housing crisis. Harper’s era was about pulling money away from crown corps in favour of paying companies friendly to the Conservative Party.