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If your only requirement for something to be socialist is the government taking over "the means of production", then the USA is also socialist, by your definition
Also, it's not my definition of socialism. The American heritage dictionary - socialism: Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy.
The "system" of the nazis was not about "distributing" it was all about consolidating power.
Yes, the goal of socialism IS all about consolidating power. That's the point. The Nazis were also in charge of distribution as well, hence all their food shortages they were suffering, just like the USSR.
The goal of socialism is to more evenly distribute resources, not about consolidating power. The food shortages were because of a war
On the food shortages - If you are referring to WWI, I could see the argument. If you are referring to WWII, not so much. WWII certainly didn't help the food situation, especially after invading Poland, but there were food issues in the country before the Nazis even took power (possibly also one of the contributing factors for why the Nazis were able to get power in the first place). One of the main topics in 1925's Mein Kampf was about seizing the farmland to the east preciously b/c of the food shortages and then the 1929 great depression hit which escalated the issue.
On the goal of socialism - I don't know man. With my rose colored glasses on, I agree with you; the intention is to create better efficiencies in production/distribution by centralizing the planning so that everyone can reap the benefits more equally. When I take those glasses off, I see the purpose as a power grab by those that position themselves near the power centers of the political organization seeking to implement those policies. This is not to say that it might not still be better than some capitalist free market laissez fairere dystopian hellscape.
Yes, aspects of the US government are socialist. This isn't news. The most glaring example being the Central banks and Federal reserve.
Ah so now it's aspects? No since the nazis nationalized businesses, as per you they were socialists. So is the USA
That's not the gotcha you think it is. I was trying to be less provocative by saying 'aspects'. I do think the USA is socialist.
I'm not surprised that you do to be honest, you got nazi Germany wrong so you getting the USA wrong tracks
My friend...
Water, electricity, sewage, the postal service, the FAA, the FDA, the SEC, the Federal Reserve, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Unemployment Insurance, SNAP, Housing vouchers, Welfare, K-12 public education, public universities, federal loans, government subsidies, bailouts, the interstate highway system, bridges, dams, national parks, progressive taxation...
Like...which other industry would you like the government to get involved in before you entertain calling it socialist? I gather that the argument can be a provocative overstatement. However, I think you would agree that "the USA has successfully integrated many socialist inspired policies into its capitalist system" is an easily defensible position.
Confusing services with socialism. Confusing fascism with socialism. Confusing capitalism with socialism. Confused, confused, confused. Narrow minds are usually very confused.
Oh hey Tiger666, good to see you again my friend. Congrats on ALMOST making an entire reply without trying to insult someone. I hope one day we can in a civil dialog 🤗
Sure it has some social benefits it's hardly socialist.
We may need to agree to disagree on this one. I take the position that since 1913 w/ the addition of the 16th amendment the USA became socialist. Again though, I do understand why that can be viewed as an overly provocative stance. The distinction for some of these terminologies can get messy.
Out of curiosity, from your perspective, what additional policies would need to be enacted to make the USA socialist?
Abolish the ruling class and distribute the resources of the country in a more fair fashion. Setup a proper social safety net so that Healthcare isn't tied to employment. For starters
Fuck yeah! I'm with you brother.
Great! Nazis still weren't socialist though. And nazis are fucking horrible