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Good news, you'll never have to feel the ick of an equitable economy or being part of a society that prioritizes the wellbeing of its citizenry over GDP here in the west.
Phew amirite? Enjoy capitalist paradise! Participation is voluntary*
*voluntary participation subject to dying in the gutter of exposure and capital defense force brutality if poor citizen fails to volunteer for capitalist exploitation. The owner class reserves all rights to kill you anyway if you threaten quarterly earnings estimates such as drawing on Healthcare benefits you paid into when you need to use them.
Nah. I'm an actual communist
My policy positions make Vladimir Lenin look like Hillary Clinton.
My problem with Marxist-Leninists, is the authoritarianism, which is the worst part about trump too.
Does it make sense now?
I think authoritarianism is bad, and even if an authoritarian agrees with me on every aspect of policy, I'll never be on their side.
It's a difference at a fundamental level.
Quick edit:
As simple as possible, they topped out at what people need to survive, a giant population of people getting just enough to live and work, to support a ruling class of politicians who were essentially oligarchs.
I think everyone should have enough to be comfortable because without that life is still miserable for 99.99% of the population, it's switching out one ruling class for another.
That's not a win, it's not changing the game. It's shuffling the cards and playing the same game we know isn't good.
Anything like anarcho-syndicalism?
Not even sure what that is, but anyone wanti g anarchism likely doesn't know what that means.
Like, if there's anarcho-luddittes out there who thinks we should completely destroy society and go back to living in the forest in tribes of ~150 people...
I wouldnt agree with them that it's the best path, but I wouldn't consider them hypocritical because at least they understand where anarchism would lead and are being honest about it
For everything else with "anarcho" tacked on the front, I feel it's safe to say I'd disagree with them without looking into what they're about.
I did go ahead and Google that before hitting reply, just to be safe since I honestly hadn't heard that term before.
And that's just putting trade unions in charge, which would end up the same as any other ruling class.
I'm saying there shouldn't be a ruling class at all.
Claims to be a communist, but has no clue about anarchists. Many of whom are actual communist/Marxist. Sure buddy, you're a super mega communist.
Anarcho-syndicalism advocates for a society without hierarchical structures, achieved through the power of worker-led trade unions BTW.
Oh yes that old capitalist Chestnut smearing the ludites. Very communist of you. Do you know who the Luddites were? How based they were? Do you understand how badly we actually need luddites right now?
You would really do yourself a service, not by reading dense tomes of theory. But by reading a few freaking basic paragraphs of description on a Wikipedia page.
Thank you for taking up this discussion. I am not able to make long posts at this time. I appreciate you.
No, it replaces what's currently at the top with a trade union...
Something where people vote for their leaders. It would be the same as we have now almost immediately.
Are you even in a union? Do you have any idea how they work or how often corrupt assholes get leadership positions for the sole purpose of personally enriching themselves?
Like, I know I just said that I'm aware I underestimate others but....
C'mon man, you legitimately don't understand how that would result in a system identical to any other party based political system?
You don't understand how fast they'd throw their origins out the window?
Even if it did it would literally be better than what we have now. But no that's incorrect. It's literally about doing away with what is considered the top. And replacing it with local answerable flat representation. Using the power of labor and the Unions to achieve that for Syndicalists. Or by other means for the other subset of anarchists, direct action etc.
SEIU, mother was with the teamsters and my father with the pipelines.
Yes, and? So are you advocating to abolish unions just like the capitalists? Not even the nutty Leninist do that. They just rig things to get their puppets in place. Corruption can happen anywhere, with anyone. Corruption isn't an inherent feature of unions.
You don't underestimate others. You far overestimate yourself. The whole point of anarchism. From the most extreme to the most milquetoast. Is literally doing away with those unanswerable hierarchy protected leaders. Flat, local, minimal governance of the consenting. Nothing more, nothing less.
It's got nothing to do with your other straw man of destroying society. Nothing at all. It's about not having a fascistic national federal government forcing their whims down your throat through a monopoly on violence. It's about some shit head governor who's never been to your town and doesn't give a shit about your town not being able to do the same to your town. It's about those who actually use the means of production having a say on them. It's about you and your neighbors deciding the rules you live by. And not someone that you have no say in at the state or federal level.
If you actually were a communist, you'd understand this. Especially if you were anti-authoritarian. Most anti-authoritarian communist realistically are going to tend to align anarcho communist. The sad thing is though. I think you are actually capable of understanding this. But contrary to the username you've chosen you actually just don't give a shit.
This is what I was talking about
Every fucking time, you people just start making shit up.
Someone could say "my favorite color is blue" and Marxists-Leninistvwould start screeching "So you want red to die and to eat their babies".
It's never a discussion, you never try to understand anything.
This is a game to you. And the only logic that goes into your thinking is "what do I claim the other person said so I look good".
I was literally asking questions about your reasons and stance. Hence the use of the squiggly little punctuation known as a question mark. But predictably, you have no answers. And worse, squealing like being questioned is some sort of personal attack.
So tell us "communist" if unions are that problematic. They aren't, but let's pretend. What is your incorruptible unit of representation? What is your strategy to reduce corruption? Surely you must have something. Surely you weren't participating in a traditional capitalist smear against historic institutions of the left.
Seriously, the way I've seen you personally gatekeep other people's political ideology. While being so ludicrously ill prepared with your own claimed ideology. It's hilarious. The way you claim to be a communist and then turned immediately around to attack communist as wanting to destroy Society. It's peak lack of self-awareness.
This person you’re discussing with is not having a discussion at all. They are literally making asinine insinuations about what you said and not engaging with the exact words that you wrote. They don’t ask genuine follow up questions to determine your intent. I’d say you should probably just agree to disagree and move on.
Everything you said about anarcho-whatever the fuck term is spot on and the downvotes really make me question people’s critical thinking ability.
It's what authortarins do...
You can't reason them out of their views, because reason wasn't involved in them getting their views in the first place.
Someone told them to hold a view, so they held it. Anyone questioning their leader is a "them" and what little surface civility it starts with, is really just there to draw in people for an argument. Like, dude went completely off the rails in 2-3 replies, and that would have happened no matter what I said.
Some people will always be like that, it's normal human variation.
So you're an "actual communist" who never bothered to actually read anything Marx or Engels wrote.