this post was submitted on 20 Nov 2024
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Chapotraphouse
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For all the complaints of "antisemitism" of the past several years, it's amazing how Snyder has been able to walk the double genocide tightrope and still be "in good standing".
My favorite question to ask people is, in which Soviet Republic did the ethnic majority become an ethnic minority as a result of the famine(s) of 1930-1933?
Everyone says Ukraine because they're dummies. It's Kazakhstan, and yet you don't see Westoids clammoring to woke genocide narratives on behalf of Kazakhs. Only Anne Applebaum does in deep psychotic NYT op-ed lore as she has to devise a good explanation of why her ideology is not the exact carbon copy of Putin's ideology with some labels moved around.
Even within Soviet Republics, it's super not clear cut what would constitute a genocide here. You have racism against different nationalities. Plenty of Ukrainians when I was growing up called Kazakhs, aziaty or churki and still do. The USSR itself was very anti-peasantry and anti pastoral/nomadic lifestyle.
If we consider the big evil Russian dictator theory both Stalin and Lenin are on record as saying Russian ethnic tendencies are actually the worst. In the history of evil Soviet dictators there are only 3 Russians: Lenin, Andropov and Gorbachev.
Lastly a lot of these fights typically rely on first mover advantage that's found in all pro-Western chauvinism. "We got to do it because we did it before the magical date when it's considered wrongbad." is literally the excuse used by the West for everything they want to condemn from genocide, to energy use, to national development. Even if there was an active evil Soviet plot to sedentarize the Kazahs and remove them from their traditional way of life, there is not a developed nation on earth that practically supports nomadic lifestyles.
It's honestly not a simple question, and in practice a question that people ask solely for political points. If we call/don't call these famines genocide won't actually get us to stop genocides and famines that are currently happening. It's just propaganda.
You know, you raised something in my mind; The Germans committed the Herero genocide in, what, 1898? Okay, 1904 to 1908. The idea that the Germans needed to look outside for inspiration is preposterous on it's face, they'd already committed genocide in their own colonies.
The conflict between agriculturalists and pastoralists/nomads is such an incredibly deep conflict in human history. Any suggested reading for how Khazaks experienced the USSR?
There is also Ostsiedlung and the so-called "Germanisation" of western slavic peoples like Wends, Polabians, etc. going back to like the 9th century; this historical record was used by the Nazis for the justification of Lebensraum.