this post was submitted on 13 May 2025
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submitted 1 day ago by PugJesus@lemmy.world to c/196@lemmy.world
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[–] knightly@pawb.social 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

Ah yes, let's make sport less accessible by introducing arbitrary limitations.

Where did I suggest that? Are you sure you aren't hallucinating? Aren't you the one demanding an arbitrary limitation on what sort of women are allowed to compete?

Do we have basketball up to 1.60m height, then up to 1.70m height, then up to 1.80m height and so on? And do we introduce different tiers within those tiers by only having people up to 1.70m and 60kg, then 1.70 and 70kg ...

I said "performance classes" not "height and weight classes".

You CANT split sport into "performance classes", at least not in a way where it would help - men would on average still be in the higher "performance class" and nothing would change.

Why not? Explain your reasoning for why women wouldn't perform to roughly the same level as everyone else in their performance class. Bonus points if you can manage to avoid sexism or classism in your explanation.

I know you probably don't want to hear that, but biologically, trans women aren't women.

I know you probably don't want to hear this, but the biological differences between cis and trans people are irrelevant. Sports were only segregated because men's precious feelings get hurt when they are bested by women. Forcing trans women to compete against men will cause men to lose to people they don't recognize as men and thereby create more problems than were solved.

Nobody has a problem with trans women in non-physical sports. Nobody would bat an eye if there was a trans women in chess.

Wow...

You should have just admitted you have no idea what you're talking about. Bans on trans women in chess have been a multi-year scandal for the International Chess Federation.

But we can't just abandon fairness for cis women in sport because we want to appease a small number of trans women, and on a physical level (especially before hormone therapy), they still do have an advantage.

Because abandoning fairness to enforce gender testing that will primarily harm cis women by excluding them from competition for having too much natural testosterone like Caster Semenya is better, right?

[–] Realitaetsverlust@lemmy.zip 0 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Explain your reasoning for why women wouldn’t perform to roughly the same level as everyone else in their performance class.

Because the entire concept of "performance class" is absolutely stupid. I don't even know how to argue against it because the entire concept is dumb. Sport is about competition, who is the best etc. Your performance class bullshit would kill that off.

I know you probably don’t want to hear this, but the biological differences between cis and trans people are irrelevant. Sports were only segregated because men’s precious feelings get hurt when they are bested by women. Forcing trans women to compete against men will cause men to lose to people they don’t recognize as men and thereby create more problems than were solved.

Actually, sports were segregated because the average women can't compete with the average man, and a single look into the guiness book of world records would show you that. However, if that's your world view, I'm sorry, no point in arguing. I'll still answer the rest, but that's probably the last thing I'll answer from you.

Bans on trans women in chess have been a multi-year scandal for the International Chess Federation.

I am well aware of that, but it shouldn't be. Chess is about intellect, not physical prowess, and women are absolutely on the same level as men.

When did they start segregating e-sports? Last I checked, the big tournaments were all mixed.

They don't ... because physical prowess is irrelevant.

Because abandoning fairness to enforce gender testing that will primarily harm cis women by excluding them from competition for having too much natural testostetone like Caster Semenya is better, right?

Caster Semenya has a condition causing her to have much higher testosterone levels than other women. That has nothing to do with trans people. I do agree that excluding her because of this is unfair.

Anyways, as I've stated above, that's the last thing I'll answer as you don't have any arguments, just feelings and "men bad". Have a good one!

[–] knightly@pawb.social 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 23 hours ago)

Because the entire concept of "performance class" is absolutely stupid.

That doesn't disprove my point, but it does prove that you don't have the patience for a civilized argument.

I don't even know how to argue against it because the entire concept is dumb. Sport is about competition, who is the best etc. Your performance class bullshit would kill that off.

Be sure you tell all the E-Sports people and professional sports players that you think ranked competition is "dumb", lol~. Sounds like you want to mix the amateur and professional leagues too, right?

Actually, sports were segregated because the average women can't compete with the average man

If that were the case, sports would have always been segregated.

Here in reality, professional baseball was only segregated after Jackie Mitchell struck out Babe Ruth and Lou Gherig at an exhibition game in April 1932. Her contract was voided by the league's commissioner the next day.

The idea that women can't compete with men is a myth that was manufactured to defend fragile male egos.

Caster Semenya has a condition causing her to have much higher testosterone levels than other women. That has nothing to do with trans people. I do agree that excluding her because of this is unfair.

Let me get this straight, you think that a cis woman who was excluded from sports for high testosterone doesn't have anything to do with the trans women who you want to exclude from sports for having testosterone?

My dude, you're the one demanding the sort of gender testing that resulted in what you yourself acknowledge is unfair exclusion.