this post was submitted on 22 Oct 2024
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Eh, and that's what I am talking about it...
Nothing would convince you. If Zelensky suceeds in wiping out every single Ukrainian from the face of Earth you will still find some excuse why it's not genocide, or why it was good... :/
So your point is that Ukraine is committing genocide by forcing their citizens to defend their country? And somehow they are the bad guys, not the imperialist Russians?
Maybe I misunderstood, but if not, that is some impressive mental gymnastics.
Zelensky's regime is commiting genocide by kidnapping people on the streets and sending them to die, yes.
As far as I know, real life doesn't work like cartoons where there is a good guy and a bad guy. I never said that Putin is a good guy, I even explicitly said otherwise (for those who like to go to through my comments). And yet, whenever I mention Zelensky exterminating Ukrainians somebody must say "BuT tHEn You SuPPoRt RuSSiA!!"...
Way less impressive than funding a war, exterminating people, mass imprisoning them and so on, and still still somehow claim that you support them...
So the argument is basically same as saying that the americans committed genocide during vietnam war because of the draft. I think it's extremely common practice to require citizens to defend your country during an invasion. I would argue this is done in most wars.
Sure, it's not great, but I don't think Zelensky is doing anything unexpected. Any European country would likely do more or less the same if Russia invaded.
As a European that's what I expect our government to do during an invasion. I would not call that genocide even if I'm sent to die.
It's not at all the same. What US government did to their own citizens and to the countries they invaded is also terrible, but US government can't really genocide US citizens. People in US can have guns and can defend themselves from being kidnapped on a street and put into vans by people in masks. We, Ukrainians, can't really defend ourselves. Our only options are running or knives / pepper sprays. It is not an effective defence mechanism against people with rifles. I am also not aware of people being kidnapped by US government (at least on the scale Zelensky is doing that) during Vietnam war. Nobody prevented people from leaving the country. The terror that Zelensky is doing is in no way comparable to what you're trying to compare it with.
Well, you don't value your life or other people's lives. I do.
do you really believe america was defending itself in the Vietnam war? is that an actual opinion that you hold?
Oh, obviously not, USA was definitely not defending itself. I was just pointing out that it would be ridiculous to say that USA was committing genocide on its own citizens when they sent them to war.
Well in the us case and precisely Vietnam, it would not be difficult to show that blacks were disproportionately drafted. The treatment of blacks could then be argued to be intentional. In the case of Ukraine I agree with the mass murder wording, for genocide I think that intent needs to be shown. So zelensky would need to intentionally kill the citizens(as in that being the goal), instead of 'just' using them like cheap meat for the machine.