this post was submitted on 04 May 2024
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I don't think HR does it by hand, they do a query for specific degree and years of experience based on what's entered into the form. Then they take the results and send those resumes to the manager. They aren't going to read through hundreds or thousands of resumes trying to find the key items.
It's an automated process.
I don't know what to tell you - I just know that I've never known an HR organization that used something like that. All the corporate websites I've ever seen have you fill out a form an attach your resume. Maybe that's changing, but not where I am.
I know they never use it either... That's the problem. 🤦♂️
There are ways to make this bullshit non-existent and the only people not using it are the actual people doing the hiring.
A lot of those systems suck, AI might have improved in the last few years since I got out of HR so maybe it's not like that any more but they always crazy inaccurate. We use to see brick layers making it through the auto screens for finance roles when we just used the software. When the software makes that crazy of a mistake then HR can't see people actually qualified for the roles their recruiting.
Honestly I wish there was a standard resume format. It would make it easier for the software and for the humans rather than everyone flexing their creativity on resume formatting.
Yet these companies have the audacity to complain that they can’t find any qualified applicants. It would be funny if it wasn’t so fucking sad.
I'm not sure what your problem with it is. The process seems to work reasonably well on my end. I'm not sure why you think the form is such a burden.
See this is why nothing improves and why the process remains to be a shit show.
On your end everything seems fine. To everyone on the other end it’s a complete failure.
If someone is looking for a job they are going through this process 20-30 times. Every fucking time it’s filling out some long form repeating all the same crap that’s in your resume.
Like I get it. You do this to make your life easier. But you do it at the expense of everyone else and in the end you glazed over all the good talent because you didn’t even know it was there since the people looking at this stuff don’t know the first thing about the role they are hiring.
The problem is on your end. Not the applicants. The really good applicants aren’t even applicants because they see this shit and NOPE out since there are plenty of good companies that don’t pull this crap.
Not sure why you think I have trouble getting good talent.
This doesn't make my life easier. I still get a mess of resumes that I have to read through and rank, then go through the interview process. It's a lot of work. But I do get good results generally.
Because all of the big corporations out there including Lockheed Martin write articles complaining about how they struggle to find qualified applicants.
The struggle i have is that a giant percentage of applicants want fully remote work, which I respect, but a lot of our work requires being hands on with hardware, so at best we're hybrid. Oh, and it's of course harder when I'm looking for something very specific. If I need someone with ten years of real time control software experience who has a software degree and hands on hardware experience, that's for sure harder. The reason so many companies are having a harder time is that unemployment is low but salaries haven't caught up. It's not that no one wants to fill out the application form.
I understand but keep in mind they’ve been saying this long before Covid. Long before there were labor issues or expectations around remote work.
I remember reading lots of articles about this back in 2015-2016. I’m sure it’s worse now but it was never really great to begin with.
The issue really isn’t the application form as much as it is that the folks doing the hiring and interviewing.
I can’t tell you how many interviews I’ve been in where the interviewer was clearly not technical but asked questions around your technical background. They don’t know the right answers from the wrong answers. These are KIDS asking tech questions to seniors. So even if your answer is right you’ll still be marked wrong because the answer wasn’t equal to what was on their paper.
It’s infuriating.
That's just crazy town, I can't imagine doing that. I manage software engineers, and I did real time control software for a couple decades before I became a manager. Here's roughly my process:
Then that's, no other interviews in the vast majority of cases; I get feedback from the team and then make my best call. If none are good fits, I'll repeat the whole process.
How you explained it I would say you’re doing it right. You truly are the exception. My apologies.
Unfortunately most of what I see in the corporate world is the opposite of that. Not every company is this way. The company I am working for today follows the same pattern that you utilize. With that said I got hired through a reference which is how it always goes here for hiring.
It seems the companies that I see this the most with are the ones spamming indeed and similar job posting sites. They aren’t very good at it which I guess is why they end up using these sites to begin with.
There seem to be more and more people who are just bad at their jobs these days. Part of that, from my vantage point, is companies expecting ever-increasing productivity with ever-decreasing resources.
In my early management days, when I wanted to hire someone, an HR person would come and meet with me to go ever exactly what I was looking for, what was critical, what was nice to have, etc. They'd post the position, but they'd also attend career fairs, connect with other agencies, etc. Then they would read through all the resumes and give me what they thought were the top candidates. And they didn't do a bad job of it. For the ones that I didn't like, they'd ask me to explain why so that they could get better.
Now it's more and more self-service. Same with IT, and other areas too.
At what point do you think things changed?
It feels like ever since 2008 companies have been in a slow grind to cut costs. It truly feels like the economy is going down the tubes and this is all just a sign of the current times.
Things definitely accelerated since Covid.
It's been a lot longer than that. Here, take a look at this graph comparing productivity to average worker salary. They were completely in sync up through the 70s, then in the 80s worker salary flattened while productivity kept on the same increasing rate. 1981 was when Reagan took office and we started with "trickle down economics." Tax cuts for the wealthy and corporations that was supposed to "trickle down" to the worker. Conservatives still tout it today, but it's never done anything other than make rich people richer and screw the economy.
The problem is that those two lines are continuing on their respective paths, and businesses are expected to grow their productivity at that rate while keeping costs (including salaries) down. So we get squeezed to do more and more with less and less.