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Is there a scientific ,logical or theoratical answer to the "what comes first chicken or egg question ? I know it's suppposed to be a paradox but i wanted to know if there is one. if there is share ? (lemmy.ml)

submitted 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) by THEDAEMON@lemmy.ml to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml

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EDIT : It seems as no one understood what i was talking about and maybe its my fault for not elaborating . I always thought chicken was a metaphor for this paradox and not really meaning chicken as a specific spiece . So my question is how did the ancestor of chicken came to be if it was born (egg) wouldn't it need a parent or if it was a parent (chicken ) woudn't it need to be born ? Or did all the creatures start out as bacteria and climbed out from ocean through evalution if so why isn't any new species being born this way or am i missing something ?

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[–] kirklennon@kbin.social 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

"Proto chicken" in this context refers to a genetic ancestor of the chicken. An egg hatches into the exact same species as the egg itself, but the egg is genetically different from the mother that laid the egg, and in this thought experiment, we're talking about the mother being different enough to call a different species.

[–] the_q@lemmy.world -4 points 10 months ago (3 children)

So if the mother was genetically different enough to be called a different species then...say it with me... the chicken came first.

[–] kirklennon@kbin.social 7 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

No, that's not right. The species transitioned from the proto-chicken to the chicken. Whichever specific individual we call the first chicken started off as (say it with me) an egg. The mother's offspring was different enough to be the first chicken.

[–] HopeOfTheGunblade@kbin.social 1 points 10 months ago

Eggs existed long before the chicken, or the species that gave birth to the chicken. What's in that egg doesn't matter, when it's the latest in a long line of eggs, the contents of this egg can't precede eggs.

[–] the_q@lemmy.world -3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

But you don't know if the proto chicken's offspring is a different kind of chicken until it's hatched. That's how you get a new species.

It's a bit of a Schrodinger's egg situation I guess.

[–] kirklennon@kbin.social 7 points 10 months ago

For what it's worth it's possible to test the contents of an egg, but it's moot because it doesn't actually matter when we know. It exists independent of observation.

[–] Zellith@kbin.social 4 points 10 months ago

Species is just a thing we use because we like to put things in boxes. It's all just transitions. The life between species could be described as it's own species if we shifted the scale. Again, boxes.

[–] snooggums@kbin.social 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The baby chicken in the egg is the same chicken that hatches from the egg, but we call it an egg until it hatches. Egg first.

[–] the_q@lemmy.world -3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You don't know what's in the egg until it hatches.

[–] Donebrach@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

so true, it could be bees for all we know.