cross-posted from: https://lemmygrad.ml/post/6886515
The realisation that the european left is actually more anti-communist than the fucking CIA.
this post was submitted on 31 Jan 2025
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chapotraphouse
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The cia thought Khruschev was good news. If there was no other reason to hate him, this is at least enough reason to never trust what came out of his mouth.
The CIA did a huge study on the USSR's gulag program in the 1960s and it turned out that inmates in it were actually treated better than those in the US prison system.
The CIA of course suppressed that info from the American public for years because it made the USSR look better than western propagandists wanted it to.
Do you have that study?
I wouldn't be surprised if correct. If you take the ww2 statistics out of the equation the gulag has a lower death rate than current US prisons. I have a post somewhere with numbers that justify this.
You should also know that the death rate for the gulags over 70 years ago was also better than the current death rate in modern US prisons and this can be proven quite easily.
When ignoring the period of 1941-1944 (nazi occupation of the soviet union and ww2) where 70% of all deaths in gulags occurred, the program actually had an incredibly low death rate for its time. In fact, by 1953 the gulag system had a LOWER death rate than current modern day US prisons have. Fact.
According to this study the gulag deaths were approximately 830,000 from 1934 to 1953. As I said above however, it is important to know that 70% of all these deaths occurred between 1941 and 1944 (included) so they can be attributed to difficulties from the War Period and nazi occupation. Also, it's important to note that antibiotics didn't become available until after WW2, this contributes significantly to earlier higher death figures.
To put things into perspective. Using the same source as above for the USSR, and this report from the Bureau of Justice Statistics we can say that Mortality in the gulag in 1953 (236 deaths per 100,000 prisoners) was lower than mortality in US prisons today, both in state prisons (303 deaths per 100,000 prisoners) and federal prisons (252 deaths per 100,000 prisoners).
Feel free to double check these numbers(you should check anyone's numbers always). I know it's surprising to hear that as far back as 1953 they were better, but it is absolutely 100% correct.
This data also doesn't include the covid years, which would make this data considerably worse for the US.
[Link to document] (uhhhh maybe I shouldn't link it since it's to the CIA's own website... I can't find an archive link unfortunately)
Summary of the report:
Title: FORCED LABOR CAMPS IN THE USSR. CIA-RDP80T00246A032000400001
A 1957 CIA document titled “Forced Labor Camps in the USSR: Transfer of Prisoners between Camps” reveals the following information about the Soviet Gulag in pages two to six:
Until 1952, the prisoners were given a guaranteed amount food, plus extra food for over-fulfillment of quotas
From 1952 onward, the Gulag system operated upon "economic accountability" such that the more the prisoners worked, the more they were paid.
For over-fulfilling the norms by 105%, one day of sentence was counted as two, thus reducing the time spent in the Gulag by one day.
Furthermore, because of the socialist reconstruction post-war, the Soviet government had more funds and so they increased prisoners' food supplies.
Until 1954, the prisoners worked 10 hours per day, whereas the free workers worked 8 hours per day. From 1954 onward, both prisoners and free workers worked 8 hours per day.
A CIA study of a sample camp showed that 95% of the prisoners were actual criminals.
In 1953, amnesty was given to 70% of the "ordinary criminals" of a sample camp studied by the CIA. Within the next 3 months, most of them were re-arrested for committing new crimes.
These findings didn't agree with the West's "Soviet Union no food" and "Soviet prisons bad" takes of the time.
ProleWiki entry on it: https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/Main_Administration_of_Camps
ProleWiki hosting the CIA document: https://en.prolewiki.org/wiki/File:CIA_four_reports_on_forced_labour_in_USSR,_1945-1955.pdf
I remember when this got posted on radlib reddit and everyone was like, "Oh so now we're trusting the CIA?" like they would lie to make the Soviet Union seem better in internal correspondence for some reason
What's crazy is, they declassify this stuff because they know their population is so propagandized that they'd never bother to read any of it. And it works.
Right, explaining the difference between internal communications that intelligence is based on is different from the things they disseminate abroud was a whole thing
Liberals like to think in 'gotchas' and marvel-esque quips
If they could do better they wouldn't be liberals, they'd either be conservatives if they were bougie fucks, or actual leftists of some kind otherwise
CIA tankie organization confirmed!!