PS … also if this sounds like a corporate press release to you folks, we still punk 🤘😜🤘

"YES FELLOW KIDS, WE ARE ALSO, HOW YOU SAY, STILL DOWN WITH "IT" "

We DO NOT plan on moving away from Lemmy as a software platform at this time.

Well that is concerning.

I don't see why the moderation tools couldn't just be improved on Lemmy. The new moderator view has been very useful for me as a moderator. We already have Lemmy and Kbin. The Sublinks about page doesn't say how it is going to be different/better than the existing options apart from moderation tools. On top of that it is made in Java instead of Rust? That's just going backwards in my opinion... This post also does not state why you guys are interested in a Lemmy alternative. You could have named some issues you have with it and why something else would be better(just like the Sublinks guys could have done in their about page). I started my communities here and put a lot of effort in them. I can't just switch instances without destroying most of the work done. The language used here really makes it sound like this instance is on borrowed time. Being able to transfer communities to another instance would be nice...

Hello there! I love lemmy.world - I moderate communities such as /c/Minecraft and /c/Relationship_Advice and will always be onboard for improving our platforms and reaching more people.

I also do not personally believe in yet another slicing of the communities into different platforms, and if Sublinks aren't integrated into Lemmy - requiring new communities or separate accounts - I will not be following along. Of course, somebody else could always take over my communities in that event, but I just wanted to let out my opinion on this.

You might not remember specific details during that whole jump in workload, but during the first week of Reddit migration, some moderators from communities that fought really hard to build an user base migrated here - one for menopausal women in particular caught my eye, as the moderator did everything in her power to migrate users who weren't tech savvy to a whole new platform. The reason this effort didn't work and most of these communities reverted back was the extreme fragmentation and confusing nature of the early Fediverse. If, for whatever reason, we add yet another layer we are explicitly saying we only care about esse of use for tech savvy programmers. This is a fine stance to have, but make it clear and explicit if that's the case.

As a final addendum, the political beliefs of the Lemmy developers never harmed any of the several opposition communities or servers - if that's the root of the matter, I'm even more disappointed.

Still, as always, I will support the .world family of servers and there's simply nobody quite as good, competent and dedicated as this team in the Fediverse.

I want to start by saying I am extremely thankful for Ruud and the team and think that you did an amazing job with lemmy.world and I wish you success in the future.

That said, I am a monthly 30 dollar donator to Lemmy and I am not interested in Sublinks. I read through the threads and my take is that I think the motivation for the development of it goes against my personal politics and mischaracterizes nutomic and dessalines. While I appreciate the nature of open source to open up avenues for people to act as they think is best, I do not want to leave the Lemmy.

Ahead of a migration to Sublinks I hope there comes a cleaner way to move communities off lemmy.world. If I had known how the Fediverse worked 11 months ago I would have self hosted an instance and shared my communities that way as to not be defederated from people I want to be federated with. Additionally I think that having a single huge lemmy instance is not great for the architecture of the fediverse as a whole and even if there were no changes planned or being considered. I think that many instances hosting communities is preferable to having large ones like lemmy.ml and lemmy.world.

Again I totally get that this is provided free and as is and as such you are free to make the decision you think is best. Even though I am a difficult person, I very much appreciate you, your team and what you are trying to accomplish. Thank you.

if this sounds like a corporate press release to you folks, we still punk 🤘😜🤘

dude that sounds even more corporate 😂😂😂😂

Just kidding, xoxo <3

I don't understand this post, at all... Did something happen to Lemmy? This post has very clear intentions.

If you just wished to help the folks at sublinks to gather information on moderation tools, as you claimed, you should have just opened an issue on their github or on their sublemmy or whatever. Do not create a sticky for 200k people to see.

We DO NOT plan on moving away from Lemmy as a software platform at this time.

At this time

Hmm.

If I'm looking to build skills in a new language, that language is probably going to be Rust and not Java. One of those languages has a bright future. The other is going to look a lot like Fortran in 15 years.

I expect real performance issues with Java at some point, especially compared to Rust. The initial difficulty in picking up the language is worth it if I never have to see another Factory pattern that only returns one type. Why just use a constructor when you can use ~~idiopathic~~ idiomatic java?

Apologies for a bit of a negative thought here ...

But I went through the survey, mainly curious to see what SL are thinking about in terms of moderation tooling, and was somewhat disappointed to see mostly broad and open ended questions. While these can be very valuable in surveys for picking up on as much information as possible, I was hoping to see more specific ideas about moderation tooling for people to provide feedback on, instead of "what do you find difficult" etc style questions.

To be harsh for a moment, it almost feels like the SL team decided they'd work on moderation tooling, then realised they don't quite know what to do and so are looking for ideas on what should be done. Now I know that's likely untrue, given that some admins and the SL teams have already had conversations. But still, I was hoping to see some manifestation of those motives and conversations in this survey. Maybe that's unreasonable of me ... I'm not sure.

All of that being said, a complaint I've made in this space before (to other platform devs), which I'll share here again ...

platform specific moderation work is a bit of a shame on the fediverse. It may not be tractable, but some form of platform generic plugin style moderation tooling really seems like where things should be headed. It would be cool if something like that was what was being worked on here rather than reinventing the wheel for a ~50,000 MAU userbase.

It could be in whatever language or stack you want. APIs are there and if new ones are needed they'd be worth working on too. You could make whatever frontend for it you like. And there is likely some interesting protocol involved too. I know there's talk about such things over on the mastodon side.

But generally, IMO, plugins, rather than whole new platforms (with blackjack and hookers) is likely what the fediverse needs at the moment given its scale (and lack of major growth in the near future).

We DO NOT plan on moving away from Lemmy as a software platform at this time.

So... you're thinking about it? That doesn't instill a lot of confidence in continuing to use this platform moving forward. I started contributing donations to the lemmy platform development, and will not be very happy if you just decide to abandon it in the future.

Are you planning on sharing the results of the survey? I think the Lemmy folks would be interested in it too.

Is there an alternate survey site that could be used other than Microsoft? The site is pretty much impossible to see in dark browser mode as well (light grey text on white background).

Aside from that though, what is the difference between Lemmy and sublinks?

After mulling this post over for awhile:

• .world has many instances in the fediverse and existed long before Lemmy.world. Ruud has never, to my knowledge, posed anything like this post about another potential fedi service. The other fediverse services have coexisted without need to position them against each other. This difference in approach implies intentions, if not outright actions with the illusion of user input.
• The prevalence of Linux users on this platform is common knowledge. So much so, it is a common complaint from users that feel excluded or uninterested in Linux. The use of Linux implies a distrust for Microsoft, and for the most part megacorporations. While the survey creator (sublinks) may receive anonymous data, Microsoft is absolutely correlating information that comes across their server and selling that data. In my opinion, this should have been an obvious thing most of the Linux community will not participate in, (myself included as one of the most active users and a mod). And it reflects poorly on the FOSS nature of sublinks. A FOSS survey system is needed badly for effective engagement.
• As many of us in the social sciences background know... Please explain the intention of this statement. I don't mean to be cynical, but to me, this implies I have been part of some science experiment of unknown intentions and implications; at the extreme end of possible meanings. I thought we were a FOSS community, many with a self hosting interest. A social sciences interest and background has entirely different motivations and raises concern for me.

While I'd like to contribute to the survey, I'm not comfortable using a Microsoft form in addition to providing uniquely identifying info

I'm still willing to contribute in other ways tho🤗

I'm excited to see more and more activity pub compatible software. These projects are created and maintained by just a few people and could stop being maintained at any point. Many of these platforms lack features that make moderation a reasonable task among other less desirable quirks. It's one of the reasons I decided against hosting my own instance.

I think it is a shame that the creators of these projects lead with stating which programming language and methodology they're using. IT DOES NOT MATTER. This is a major sticking point for the pedants. Just tell us what it does, leave the technical aspects of the project in the docs for the people that it actually matters to.

The mix of microblogging and threaded posts should be interesting. Kbin has both, but they are not intermingled. I personally don't use microblogging, but I do see screenshots of posts on here, which is basically the same thing I suppose.

As far as complaining about fracturing of the userbase, well, this is an issue across the Internet. There's Facebook groups, Reddit, message boards, YouTube, Twitch, TikTok, and too many other platforms to list, all fracturing topic enthusiasts and competing for users. I believe that more projects will allow the fediverse to contribute to grow and eventually mature into something a lot of people will use. More projects and forks means more ways to try new ideas and improvement without a single project owner preventing growth of the entire ecosystem.

LMAO, Sublinks devs are so engrained in Java that they want to rewrite Rust in Java, and their survey they send is written in Office 365? They're a meme.

The Java idea is absurd and shouldn't be taken seriously.

I disagree with the Lemmy devs' political views a great deal, but:

1. It's open source so you can audit if they're doing anything bad
2. Just fork it and improve if you have issues with the code they're writing / features

Java is a horrible language. Nearly every developer I've talked to in the last several decades agrees, even previously hardcore Java devs. Please just stop.

Microsoft 365? Lol.

Thank you, corporate press release overlords.

Whoa. Some of us moderators are just average users who escaped from Reddit. I moderate two small niche support groups. (Stopdrinking and bipolar) I know the other moderator in bipolar is about the same tech level as me. (NOT coders!).

This sounds like we need to rehome our groups???