As I understand it, the black Panthers were so successful, laws were passed to stop them; why don't people LEGALLY walk in groups open carrying to keep ICE polite?

In states that allow open carry without a permit, do so; in ones that require a permit or license, get one; of course again, keep everything within the bounds of the law.

Edit: also travel in groups, the larger the better

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments

[–] darkcalling@hexbear.net 37 points 2 days ago (5 children)

I'll just point out things were a lot different then compared to now.

Cops back then didn't have body armor of any kind usually (kevlar was brand new and not widely available nor was it guaranteed to stop bullets from rifles as commonly carried by the panthers). They also usually had at best a pistol, maybe a shotgun in the car or trunk in some cases. They often patrolled alone or maybe two cops and might have encountered two panthers armed, not good odds for the cops that at least one if not both gets a funeral if they start shit.

Cops back then weren't as organized, as militarized. They couldn't call out a helicopter gunship, they didn't have surveillance drones doing overwatch. They couldn't scream on the horn and get 10 armed agents from several agencies there in 20 minutes as emergency back-up.

The US was openly trying to appear good compared to the USSR and was very determined not to do many if any massacres if they could help it because it made them look bad in their attempts to woo the non-aligned states.

Compare to now. These ICE types wear heavy modern body armor with plates that can stop rifle rounds. They receive military training, they operate in tactical squads. They carry automatic weapons. They have overwatch. They can call for and get SWAT multi-agency heavily armed back-up with even more automatic weapons and armored vehicles within 15 minutes in many cases.

They do not operate within a state that has a USSR it cares to try and compete against, it has no interest in trying to pretend it isn't somewhat racist nor does it care about shouting about maximalist liberal freedoms.

So there's less restraint, the opponents are more heavily armed, have body armor, have better military training, travel in numbers at all times, and are itching for an escalation that lets them use even more force and/or declare martial law.

The US of the 1960s and 1970s had a more serious risk of serious prolonged insurgency due to the social and economic upheaval of the era than now which they also had an interest on tamping down on and not feeding. The propaganda wasn't as good, we hadn't seen end of history yet with the USSR being illegally dissolved.

[–] Ekranoplane@hexbear.net 14 points 2 days ago (3 children)

How does SWAT rapid response actually work? Are there a bunch of guys constantly ready to go in a warehouse somewhere? What even is SWAT, are they part of the normal police?

[–] MutilationWave@lemmy.dbzer0.com 14 points 2 days ago

They are part of normal police. It stands for Special Weapons And Tactics. They are more heavily armed and armored compared to regular cops. They have armored vehicles, better training, and more stringent fitness requirements. The only time I saw a SWAT raid up close they closed down my street and had two snipers because a man robbed a nearby gas station convenience store with a shotgun. They killed him.

[–] InevitableSwing@hexbear.net 10 points 2 days ago

Here's a 2015 quote from economist.com. Budgets expanded beyond belief from $1m in 1990 to nearly $450m in 2013. And the number of times they were used exploded 17 times. 3,000 in 1980 to 50,000 times.

→ The American Civil Liberties Union found that the value of military equipment used by American police departments has risen from $1m in 1990 to nearly $450m in 2013. The equipment has been used. In 1980 SWAT teams across America were deployed around 3,000 times. Deployments are estimated to have risen nearly seventeen-fold since, to 50,000 a year.

Of course - 2015 was ten years ago so things have surely gotten even worse.

[–] Horse@lemmygrad.ml 10 points 2 days ago

How does SWAT rapid response actually work? Are there a bunch of guys constantly ready to go in a warehouse somewhere?

depends on the department, but usually the pigs in the department's swat team(s) are also regular cops and they get notified by dispatch when they are needed if they are clocked in, or literally paged if not
then they put on lights and sirens to get to the station quickly and arm up

What even is SWAT, are they part of the normal police?

heavily armed response teams and yes, usually

load more comments (1 replies)